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MCT and the runs ?

by (2407)
Updated about 24 hours ago
Created June 28, 2013 at 6:46 AM

If im not used to it, a mere tablespoon makes painful cramps and water diarrhea within an hour.

I titrated slowly and now safely take 15g with my coffee and 15g with my lunch.

Safely....or so I thought.

While I am not getting any pain, nor immediate bowel reactions, I am shitting water or soup on every movement, for the past month or two.

I didnt associate it with the MCT because of the lack of any pain, gas, cramps, nausea, or immediate movements.

So I've been eliminating things methodically to no avail. I'm gonna try to eliminate MCT next, but I'm loathe to do so bc it's great energy and a great keto-switcher.

Anyone else fail to get accustomed to MCT over time?

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2407 · September 02, 2013 at 8:20 AM

It wasn't the MCT. It was other factors. 15g feels fine. 30g is high. Coconut oil is long chain fat an takes 3 hrs minimum to actually reach the mitochondria. Long chain fat in the morning on an IF is like throwing a log on a small kindling fire.

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1232 · August 10, 2013 at 7:02 AM

I'm not an expert on MCT but 30g a day of the pure stuff seems like a LOT, even for someone going ketogenic. Have you tried substituting for coconut oil?

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11204 · July 01, 2013 at 5:33 PM

I might be able to manage a tablespoon or two. If I mix it with something I'm less likely to have problems.

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2407 · June 30, 2013 at 11:44 PM

So, how much MCT can you tolerate in a day? I can eat hunks of coconut oil with no problems. MCT, another story. As you said, allergies are to proteins; MCT is so processed I doubt there is any allergy there. I can tell you, on keto IF, there is NOTHING LIKE MCT. Energy is immediate and clean burning. Doesn't take 4hrs to start hitting your cells like reg fat. Doesn't screw your blood sugar then drop you like carbs. I eat lean meat and MCT at lunch and I'm golden. Except the damn brown water no2. Dammit.

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2407 · June 30, 2013 at 11:38 PM

I could eat 50-70g of coconut oil per day and never had a problem. I was also keto zero carb meat and fat only and even with all that fat, no problems. So bile salts are not the issue with me. Pure MCT does not need bile salts or lipase, it passes the intestinal barrier into the blood with ease, unlike LCT. That's why the energy is so awesome and quick. LCT take 3-4hrs for the cells to actually start being able to use the energy. That's why it sucks using LCT during exercise. I cut out MCT two days ago, we will see if that's it.

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3 Answers

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11204 · June 28, 2013 at 3:37 PM

Yep. Of course, I have to enter fifteen characters just to say yep.

I really wanted to eat a lot of fat because I wanted to stay pretty much ketogenic most of the time. I can eat fatty foods, add a chunk of butter to something, but MCT oil at levels people usually use to generate ketones can easily cause distress. I seem to be allergic to coconut oil, or perhaps to coconut in general, since it is usually proteins that cause problems- though coconut also has FODMAPS. If it is any consolation, you can tell yourself it isn't really paleo, because it is processed and all.

Ever try juice of potato ala Ray Peat for ketoacids? I did. It was interesting, but there is starch too. Now, since Nikoley did the resistant starch thing, and the main thing they are using to dose with resistant starch is potato starch, maybe I should pull out the juicer again and just try to drink the raw juice. Peat says to cook the hell out of it because he doesn't like starch for some reason, but he also doesn't want to believe in any new research either. I don't know if the ketoacids need cooking or not, and the resistant starch doesn't seem to cause blood sugar or insulin spikes like regular starch would. Now, if only it didn't turn brown so quickly.

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11204 · July 01, 2013 at 5:33 PM

I might be able to manage a tablespoon or two. If I mix it with something I'm less likely to have problems.

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2407 · June 30, 2013 at 11:44 PM

So, how much MCT can you tolerate in a day? I can eat hunks of coconut oil with no problems. MCT, another story. As you said, allergies are to proteins; MCT is so processed I doubt there is any allergy there. I can tell you, on keto IF, there is NOTHING LIKE MCT. Energy is immediate and clean burning. Doesn't take 4hrs to start hitting your cells like reg fat. Doesn't screw your blood sugar then drop you like carbs. I eat lean meat and MCT at lunch and I'm golden. Except the damn brown water no2. Dammit.

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10 · June 28, 2013 at 3:23 PM

Yes, when I first started experimenting with MCT and coconut oil I found that there was definitively an upper limit to how much I could tolerate without some kind of GI distress. For me, it seems like the max MCT I can handle is about a tablespoon, and coconut oil a little more than that.

As I understand it, your gall bladder only produces so much bile salts on a daily basis to break down fat, and when you hit it with a load of fat all at once, it's going to empty out in response (depending on how much you have). If it is depleted and you hit it again with fat later, the body is going to have a tough time processing that fat and may just push it through.

It then takes another day to build up the bile salts stores, and if your fat intake stays relatively consistent your body will adjust over time and produce more to compensate for the higher fat intake. However, I've also heard caution that if you decrease your fat intake, you should do also it slowly to give your body time to adjust so that you end up with an excess of bile salts and possible gall stones down the line.

Maybe an over-simplification of how it works, but that's my layman's take on it.

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2407 · June 30, 2013 at 11:38 PM

I could eat 50-70g of coconut oil per day and never had a problem. I was also keto zero carb meat and fat only and even with all that fat, no problems. So bile salts are not the issue with me. Pure MCT does not need bile salts or lipase, it passes the intestinal barrier into the blood with ease, unlike LCT. That's why the energy is so awesome and quick. LCT take 3-4hrs for the cells to actually start being able to use the energy. That's why it sucks using LCT during exercise. I cut out MCT two days ago, we will see if that's it.

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880 · June 28, 2013 at 12:39 PM

Never tried straight MCT, but from what I understand, since it's so easily digested, if you take it straight, it'll run right through you. Can you try combining it with meals in both cases (not just lunch) and see if things clear up?

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2407 · September 02, 2013 at 8:20 AM

It wasn't the MCT. It was other factors. 15g feels fine. 30g is high. Coconut oil is long chain fat an takes 3 hrs minimum to actually reach the mitochondria. Long chain fat in the morning on an IF is like throwing a log on a small kindling fire.

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