1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
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Are there any studies demonstrating deleterious affects of whole grains?

by (14877)
Updated about 21 hours ago
Created March 02, 2013 at 7:33 PM

I am just wondering if anyone could point me to some studies demonstrating the negative affects of whole (not processed/refined) grain consumption. Preferably I'd like them to be done on healthy individuals, but if not that's fine too. Post what you can.

Thanks in advance.

8b9c2dcd3dfc929a0428d3d6dac4918e
60 · January 13, 2014 at 1:51 PM

The greeks have the literal highest rate of "IBS" in the world, by country. Id be fascinated to know what there rates of inflamatory and autoimmune diseases are too.

8b9c2dcd3dfc929a0428d3d6dac4918e
60 · January 13, 2014 at 1:49 PM

....

Conversely, celiac patients have increased cancer, osteoporosis, and autoimmune diseases like DM I, autoimmune thyroid disease, Multiple Sclerosis, Sjogren disease, Rheumatoid arthritis, neuropathies, and even neurological disorders like schizophrenia. We don't know how big the iceberg is with these diseases, but the tip seems very large". And those stastics connect _PRECISELY_ with the paleo model for the development of auto-immune and inflamatory diseases via anti-nutrients (for which medicine has no current etiology)

8b9c2dcd3dfc929a0428d3d6dac4918e
60 · January 13, 2014 at 1:48 PM

Got to love Kurt harris yes, very well summed this bit -

"Fully 1% of the population has celiac disease, with 97% of these currently undiagnosed. 30% of the population has the genetic HLA haplotype that is susceptible to celiac disease -we can only know which of these 30% have it by testing. Celiac disease is caused by gluten grain consumption, with the offending gliadin proteins heat stable and not destroyed by cooking. Nearly every common autoimmune disease described is associated with at least an order of magnitude increased risk of celiac disease. .....

8b9c2dcd3dfc929a0428d3d6dac4918e
60 · January 13, 2014 at 1:37 PM

Precisely, studies, especially long term, large scale ones, need serious funding. Those are usually the finacial interests that what the marketing PR. Who would attack whole grains? Dairy is smaller than agrigiants and is primarily concerned with undoing the slurs already levelled against it by agri giant "science". Its all about money. If there's no money, there's no study.

0775549e75987e08e0ca18585a757433
168 · May 03, 2013 at 7:23 PM

So what's the verdict? Are whole grains healthy?

A08b210e4da7e69cd792bddc1f4aae4b
1031 · April 12, 2013 at 12:03 AM

That Living Yoga post has some 'fascinating' bits, my favourite was "naturally structured water" -- WTF?!

Ebb10603524dd22621c1155dd7ddf106
19120 · March 07, 2013 at 6:47 PM

@giacinto Good luck on your path, but try not to rage quit - it's just not a becoming behavior.

7fc82eebafd44badc73c520f44660150
3280 · March 07, 2013 at 5:45 PM

why are you disillusioned ?

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46
41422 · March 07, 2013 at 3:30 PM

As wrong headed as those paleo folks who get wrapped in the romantic aspects of their own diet...

A2c38be4c54c91a15071f82f14cac0b3
12677 · March 07, 2013 at 3:28 PM

I have an interesting paper saved on my computer somewhere of an RCT where attempting to prevent colon tumors with wheat bran resulted in the opposite effect, to the obvious surprise of the researchers.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 3:10 PM

It's my understanding that before the 1800's the peasant class ate whole grains becausen refined white flour was more intensive to make and was TF held for the elite class (I'm not 100% on this) but if that's true then Tanchou's formula would be relevant since it would more probably apply to whole grains Consumption being a primary cause for cancers. I'm still looking for this formula, it would be really interesting to see if his formula applied to nation states. And I'm confident the UN publishes data on grain consumption import/export/production, and cancer rates, I'd love to see if it held.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 3:05 PM

This* study. ... Because they don't have an increased oatmeal group with increased fat sol. Vitamins.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 3:04 PM

The cereal free diet has the least tooth decay and their decay may even be statistically insignificant, but because of the confounding variable of supplemental vitamin d in that study I couldn't comfortably say much about it other than what would seem pretty obvious, which is that there is probably a positive linear correlation between grain consumption and dental caries which is at least in part mediated by fat soluble vitamins, specifically vitamin d. But to me is study doesn't say much about whole grains specifically.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 2:53 PM

Yea, I guess I was thinking whole wheat bread, the fact that oats were the most detrimental to teeth in the mellanby study didn't even cross my mind. The title of it though is "the influence of a cereal-free diet rich in vitamin d and calcium on dental caries in children" published in the British medical journal march 19th 1932 By may mellanby and c lee pattison. I don't have the link to it offhand though.

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 07, 2013 at 2:50 PM

Found it. This guy http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2010/12/dr-mellanbys-tooth-decay-reversal-diet.html

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 07, 2013 at 2:49 PM

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2010/12/dr-mellanbys-tooth-decay-reversal-diet.html

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 07, 2013 at 2:40 PM

Thanks, brah. I'm surprised you didn't post the study of oats and vitamin D deficiency. Done by somebody whose name starts with an M? I think he was a dentist too.

Medium avatar
10176 · March 03, 2013 at 12:05 AM

Here's an interesting critique. Though not a scientific study, it's a non-paleo argument against complex carbs....durianrider-esque. http://livingyoganow.com/art_whole_truth_about_whole_grains.html

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 02, 2013 at 9:50 PM

great but that's not really a study.

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 02, 2013 at 9:49 PM

Great but that's not really a study.

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6 Answers

A2c38be4c54c91a15071f82f14cac0b3
4
12677 · March 02, 2013 at 11:30 PM

If you pick and choose diet trials measuring risk factors you can make a case for either side, so I generally look at the Diet and Reinfarction Trial since it had actual clinical endpoints.

http://eurheartjsupp.oxfordjournals.org/content/3/suppl_D/D75.full.pdf

Basically, over 2000 heart disease patients were randomized into two groups and told to either increase their fiber intake by switching to whole grains or do nothing and keep on eating them refined grains.

After 2 years there had been more coronary heart disease events, CHD deaths, and deaths in general in the group eating the whole grains. None of these results reached statistical significance, though CHD deaths was likely quite close.

It's no smoking gun, but I don't presume whole grains to be some deadly food or anything so I guess I'm not surprised.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
2
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 2:30 PM

In his book, Cancer: Disease of Civilization?: An Anthropological and Historical Study, Vilhjalmur Stefansson reported on a presentation made by Stanislas Tanchou in 1842 to the Paris Medical Society.

Tanchou, a physician and surgeon, spoke on cancer, and claimed he could predict the exact rates of cancer in the major European cities, and based his predictions on the percentage of grain consumed in each city. His predictions were recorded, and over time, were shown to be completely accurate. In the cities where grain consumption levels were high, cancer rates were high, and vice versa.

And Weston Price, in his research in the 1930s, showed that in fact, in hunter gather societies where no grain is consumed, cancer does not manifest. This is why Stefansson called cancer "a disease of civilization".

Not a study per se but I've always found that interesting.

A2c38be4c54c91a15071f82f14cac0b3
12677 · March 07, 2013 at 3:28 PM

I have an interesting paper saved on my computer somewhere of an RCT where attempting to prevent colon tumors with wheat bran resulted in the opposite effect, to the obvious surprise of the researchers.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 3:10 PM

It's my understanding that before the 1800's the peasant class ate whole grains becausen refined white flour was more intensive to make and was TF held for the elite class (I'm not 100% on this) but if that's true then Tanchou's formula would be relevant since it would more probably apply to whole grains Consumption being a primary cause for cancers. I'm still looking for this formula, it would be really interesting to see if his formula applied to nation states. And I'm confident the UN publishes data on grain consumption import/export/production, and cancer rates, I'd love to see if it held.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 3:05 PM

This* study. ... Because they don't have an increased oatmeal group with increased fat sol. Vitamins.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 3:04 PM

The cereal free diet has the least tooth decay and their decay may even be statistically insignificant, but because of the confounding variable of supplemental vitamin d in that study I couldn't comfortably say much about it other than what would seem pretty obvious, which is that there is probably a positive linear correlation between grain consumption and dental caries which is at least in part mediated by fat soluble vitamins, specifically vitamin d. But to me is study doesn't say much about whole grains specifically.

Cb9a270955e2c277a02c4a4b5dad10b5
10994 · March 07, 2013 at 2:53 PM

Yea, I guess I was thinking whole wheat bread, the fact that oats were the most detrimental to teeth in the mellanby study didn't even cross my mind. The title of it though is "the influence of a cereal-free diet rich in vitamin d and calcium on dental caries in children" published in the British medical journal march 19th 1932 By may mellanby and c lee pattison. I don't have the link to it offhand though.

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 07, 2013 at 2:50 PM

Found it. This guy http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2010/12/dr-mellanbys-tooth-decay-reversal-diet.html

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 07, 2013 at 2:49 PM

http://wholehealthsource.blogspot.com/2010/12/dr-mellanbys-tooth-decay-reversal-diet.html

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 07, 2013 at 2:40 PM

Thanks, brah. I'm surprised you didn't post the study of oats and vitamin D deficiency. Done by somebody whose name starts with an M? I think he was a dentist too.

89fa2da4805b0b4e54b77a5a20a2e206
2
2097 · March 05, 2013 at 7:46 AM

heres a study...(and a trillion more in the related studies..) let me know what you make of it all

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18175740

or heres what seems like a well formed argument after reviewing the evidence the survey says.... http://www.archevore.com/panu-weblog/2009/6/23/the-argument-against-cereal-grains.html

8b9c2dcd3dfc929a0428d3d6dac4918e
60 · January 13, 2014 at 1:48 PM

Got to love Kurt harris yes, very well summed this bit -

"Fully 1% of the population has celiac disease, with 97% of these currently undiagnosed. 30% of the population has the genetic HLA haplotype that is susceptible to celiac disease -we can only know which of these 30% have it by testing. Celiac disease is caused by gluten grain consumption, with the offending gliadin proteins heat stable and not destroyed by cooking. Nearly every common autoimmune disease described is associated with at least an order of magnitude increased risk of celiac disease. .....

3d0093dd591d9b88db74d7bba970dea0
2
222 · March 02, 2013 at 9:23 PM

I doubt such a study would find funding or that anyone would even conceive it as useful, but it would be really interesting to see how much of the SAD malaise is caused by acellular carbohydrates rather than problematic proteins and such.

8b9c2dcd3dfc929a0428d3d6dac4918e
60 · January 13, 2014 at 1:37 PM

Precisely, studies, especially long term, large scale ones, need serious funding. Those are usually the finacial interests that what the marketing PR. Who would attack whole grains? Dairy is smaller than agrigiants and is primarily concerned with undoing the slurs already levelled against it by agri giant "science". Its all about money. If there's no money, there's no study.

A08b210e4da7e69cd792bddc1f4aae4b
1031 · April 12, 2013 at 12:03 AM

That Living Yoga post has some 'fascinating' bits, my favourite was "naturally structured water" -- WTF?!

Medium avatar
10176 · March 03, 2013 at 12:05 AM

Here's an interesting critique. Though not a scientific study, it's a non-paleo argument against complex carbs....durianrider-esque. http://livingyoganow.com/art_whole_truth_about_whole_grains.html

1e732e5ac9820eeb35a70276cf6c05f7
0
0 · January 13, 2014 at 10:11 AM

I think considering grains as a whole is too simplistic. For example it looks like wheat cause heart disease while oat is good for your heart.

5616e8de3e99ae199d9fd896098a331a
-2
571 · March 02, 2013 at 9:38 PM

I am disillusioned by the paleo approach. Thank god this affair only lasted a month. I return to my grains and my mediterranean diet.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/28/magazine/the-island-where-people-forget-to-die.html?pagewanted=all&_r=1&

"Their diet was also typical: a breakfast of goat???s milk, wine, sage tea or coffee, honey and bread. Lunch was almost always beans (lentils, garbanzos), potatoes, greens (fennel, dandelion or a spinachlike green called horta) and whatever seasonal vegetables their garden produced; dinner was bread and goat???s milk. At Christmas and Easter, they would slaughter the family pig and enjoy small portions of larded pork for the next several months."

8b9c2dcd3dfc929a0428d3d6dac4918e
60 · January 13, 2014 at 1:51 PM

The greeks have the literal highest rate of "IBS" in the world, by country. Id be fascinated to know what there rates of inflamatory and autoimmune diseases are too.

Ebb10603524dd22621c1155dd7ddf106
19120 · March 07, 2013 at 6:47 PM

@giacinto Good luck on your path, but try not to rage quit - it's just not a becoming behavior.

7fc82eebafd44badc73c520f44660150
3280 · March 07, 2013 at 5:45 PM

why are you disillusioned ?

32f5749fa6cf7adbeb0b0b031ba82b46
41422 · March 07, 2013 at 3:30 PM

As wrong headed as those paleo folks who get wrapped in the romantic aspects of their own diet...

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 02, 2013 at 9:50 PM

great but that's not really a study.

1edb06ded9ccf098a4517ca4a7a34ebc
14877 · March 02, 2013 at 9:49 PM

Great but that's not really a study.

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