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[META] Why are you so stingy with your upvotes?

by (78422)
Updated about 22 hours ago
Created June 12, 2011 at 6:35 PM

We have a ridiculous number of upvotes to use every day, yet I see popular questions that haven't broken ten votes, with dozens of answers unsorted by voting.

If a thread is interesting enough for me to click through to, I'll upvote it. If there is even one good line in an answer, or something else I like about it, I'll upvote it. Despite my liberal usage, I've only run out of votes a handful of times.

Does anyone have similar, or otherwise interesting voting habits? Despite having a virtually unlimited supply, why are you so stingy with your upvotes?

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55 · January 17, 2014 at 3:25 AM

bounce...

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5201 · August 07, 2012 at 8:59 PM

I also think that down-voting is counter-productive.

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2954 · June 20, 2012 at 10:52 PM

I wouldn't say they're doing me a favor, a lot of times they're doing me a diservice because I wasted my time in reading their answere. To do me a favor those people should just not answer B-) I agree wirh you that if you start a question, then you manage it.

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10044 · April 20, 2012 at 12:39 AM

It's rare to see anyone here like you with no down votes in their voting history. That's kind of cool.

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5629 · November 29, 2011 at 6:35 PM

Just ran out of upvotes on you.

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9647 · November 29, 2011 at 6:25 PM

Likewise, and you will receive a good tip if I ever come into your bar in NYC.

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24523 · November 29, 2011 at 5:51 PM

Anti- anti-sympathy upvote.

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5629 · November 15, 2011 at 3:42 AM

Apparently someone decided they wanted to anti-sympathy downvote me. :(

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15229 · November 10, 2011 at 10:10 PM

errrr, thanks rich. out of all the strange reasons to downvote someone, that has to be one of the top three ive seen.

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5629 · November 10, 2011 at 5:01 AM

Here ya go FED, +1. Quid pro quo my friend.

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10044 · November 10, 2011 at 1:50 AM

+1 to counter downvote :-P

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19479 · November 10, 2011 at 1:34 AM

You just got yourself a sympathy upvote my friend (vis a vis WCC Paul's math, this should lead to a flood of upvotes).

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3180 · November 10, 2011 at 12:07 AM

DOWNVOTE BECAUSE YOU WERE BRAGGING ABOUT LACK OF DOWNVOTES

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37187 · November 09, 2011 at 11:19 PM

Thanks much (hope it lets me post this.)

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56616 · November 09, 2011 at 10:50 PM

yeah patrik said we were doing a software upgrade today, so prob related

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24271 · November 09, 2011 at 10:47 PM

Or it was, lol.

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24271 · November 09, 2011 at 10:47 PM

Yes there's a glitch. It's happening to many of us.

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11478 · June 15, 2011 at 2:39 PM

Sorry Alfredo. My point was directed towards the general PaleoHacks community, not to you specifically. I know that you always pay attention to the threads you start. Cheers

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78422 · June 15, 2011 at 12:07 AM

Bait taken, sir. Well played.

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15229 · June 13, 2011 at 9:15 PM

yeah i ran into that the other day. people were being so damn funny i was handing out upvotes left and right, but it was mostly on comments, then then i got a message upvoting another comment telling me i couldnt upvote anymore for the day. foiled!! im far more liberal with my comment upvoting than my answer upvoting. i use that like the "like" button on facebook- like an interwebs fist bump.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 5:36 PM

Hmm, confusing. I've been keeping track of my votes today and upvoting comments doesn't seem to add to the vote count. And yet I saw recently that someone couldn't upvote a comment until the next day came. Maybe if you reach 30 on answer upvotes then a side effect is that you aren't allowed to upvote comments? Confusing.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 5:15 PM

Ah, that's excellent. Just as I find the weirdness of math people kind of awesome I also have a certain respect for the medieval re-enactors. I remember when MDA had that competition to win a cow and everyone was supposed to hold picnics and film them. I really liked the people who dressed up like cavemen and carried big logs around. We're not supposed to be re-enactors in our dieting philosophy, sure, but that picnic looked really fun. Although I admit that if huge clocks started melting that would be a little bit too much.

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12369 · June 13, 2011 at 5:15 PM

Yay for the paleo cheerleaders!

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3891 · June 13, 2011 at 4:50 PM

@Wcc Paul: I thought I had seen it all in the various shades of nerdiness, being a math guy and all, until I attended a Mardi Gras party one year almost exclusively populated by overly serious medieval re-enactors. It was like a cross between a Chuck Palahniuk story, an Ionesco play, and a Salvador Dali painting. :-))

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2977 · June 13, 2011 at 3:30 PM

Very well said - both of you!

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2977 · June 13, 2011 at 3:29 PM

I often upvote a Question I've posted an Answer to. Even if it was a "lame" question, I was still interested enough to spend time thinking about an articulating an answer. Answering is itself a kind of vote. I have yet to downvote a Question or Answer and unless it's overtly offensive I never will, mostly for the reasons WCC Paul states, and also that I'm not a 100% skilled judge of character and my being irked at an answer (say, on a politically hot topic) doesn't mean I can't respect and even admire that person in other ways.

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3891 · June 13, 2011 at 3:12 PM

Come on, Jack you can do it! It's the Chicago way, ya know. Now let me see if I can get my aunt's cats registered to vote for the next election. I'm pretty generous, especially if something interests me or someone is new to the community, though I am starting to draw the line on near verbatim repeats.

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3891 · June 13, 2011 at 3:05 PM

Your first sentence sums up my opinion, though I was going to use 10 to the power 100 instead of 8494390213421304. ;-)

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3631 · June 13, 2011 at 2:48 PM

excellent point re downvote =>rep increase. I prolly won't be using that option anymore. Totally agree w/upvoting 0 score Qs and As, esp when the person has put some thought into it. I hate seeing questions with 0 votes, with several answers - if the question was interesting enough to answer, surely it can be considered "useful and clear".

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15976 · June 13, 2011 at 11:30 AM

Oh i get it now. Bizarre that its taken me this long. That pic i couldnt resist - its from just a few days ago, June 4th, me and three friends did the Spartan Race in Tuxedo Ridge NY. Thats my neice in the pic. Good to get out the city now and again.

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6889 · June 13, 2011 at 11:06 AM

I'll upvote you because I learned something new. I didn't even know we could run out of upvotes.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 7:20 AM

I should probably add that I've just been doing lots more upvoting in general, not just from 0 to 1. But increasing 0-to-1 votes seems like an important project we could all engage in.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 7:18 AM

Thanks guys! Not so sure about that professional logician thing though ... Those math guys are weird -- as I'm sure Travis McBride could tell us. (Though not including Travis of course!)

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 3:27 AM

Love the new pic, Ben!

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5232 · June 13, 2011 at 2:31 AM

Thanks, Futureboy! :)

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 2:20 AM

Not including Travis though! Whoops!

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 2:19 AM

Thanks guys! Not so sure about that professional logician thing though ... Those math guys are *weird* -- as I'm sure Travis McBride could tell us.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 2:15 AM

Genius, Melissa! We should all have donate buttons on our user pages.

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2977 · June 13, 2011 at 1:59 AM

It's a great list! And probably the reason I didn't see it was very simple: my glasses broke today and I have one side propped over one eye while squinting the other closed! I'll check again after a trip to Walgreen's later tonight.

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15229 · June 13, 2011 at 1:47 AM

haaa! thanks, lady. i needed those ten extra reputation points so i could sleep well tonight! <3

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:32 AM

I found myself nodding along with this "ive been involved in a few online forums in my life, and this has been by far the most intelligent, welcoming, and helpful. i value the people here in their diversity of knowledge and experience. in general, i think that everyone here has just the best of intentions, and that this community does an excellent job of policing itself." so I upvoted. ;)

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:31 AM

I always lurk before I start posting somewhere, I think it's important to get the feel for a community before you just jump in.

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:30 AM

Awesome answer Paul! I upvote a lot from 0 to 1 for the same reason. I think I am much pickier about questions I upvote than answers.

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24523 · June 13, 2011 at 1:29 AM

Thoughtful is an understatement-- Paul should be a professional logician.

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:27 AM

Yeah, but in the true Chicago way, they'll cost you! ;) You can send "donations" to ......

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:26 AM

You spent the time compiling it though, Paul! <3

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 1:24 AM

I agree with Rose and Vrimj: it's nice to see what the community has decided is valuable -- even if, of course, you might disagree with the community, and even if you try to read all the answers in a thread, as I always try to do. And nice new picture, Ben: it's like you just drove from the city in your old avatar to the country in your new avatar.

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15229 · June 13, 2011 at 1:22 AM

you are a very thoughtful person, WCC.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 1:22 AM

Oh and let's not forget that I am only partially responsible for that thread. Most of the links come from people other than myself, including Sherpa Melissa (of course!).

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 1:19 AM

In the words of Jim Morrison: "The Midwest ... is the best."

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 12:56 AM

The daily limit is 30. I always assumed that this was just upvotes on answers, but now I think that this is a combination of upvotes on answers and upvotes on comments.

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24523 · June 13, 2011 at 12:54 AM

Travis McBride, sherpamelissa, WCC Paul...those Chicagoans know how to wield a vote.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 12:44 AM

Oh, that's excellent, I never noticed that about Travis McBride. Don't forget Ed: 2,260 upvotes, in about 15 months probably.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 12:40 AM

@CaveRat: It's a link in this text on the FAQ: "If it is your first time here - I would recommend reading this thread to get started." Maybe about 25-30% of the way down the page?

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 12:39 AM

Thanks! I should also say: when you choose the "newest" tab on a particular thread then the website learns that that's your preference and sets all the other threads that way.

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6235 · June 13, 2011 at 12:29 AM

Awesome info WCC Paul!

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5629 · June 13, 2011 at 12:25 AM

I upvoted this. ;)

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5629 · June 13, 2011 at 12:24 AM

I was gonna answer...but now I don't have to! Great minds think alike!

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5629 · June 13, 2011 at 12:21 AM

If a question gets me thinking I upvote. Funny jokes get upvoted. Good info gets upvoted. Trolls and stupidity get downvoted...which is super rare here. I think I've only ever downvoted like...10 times maybe less?

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2977 · June 13, 2011 at 12:08 AM

jWell that is interesting Melissa - lots of great info there! But I had to follow the link to see it - I didn't see it on the FAQ page. Or is it right in front of me and I"m just not seeing it?

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18417 · June 13, 2011 at 12:07 AM

he has over 1,000 upvotes in just 5 months. That's over 200 per month. Also, sherpamelissa has over 1400 in just 7 months.

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9647 · June 12, 2011 at 11:07 PM

Answers within a question are only ordered by vote if you have it set up that way -- though it is the default setting. I prefer to arrange my answers from newest to oldest; that way I can follow the *development* of the discussion. (And of course I can still see the vote totals.)

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18701 · June 12, 2011 at 10:39 PM

This awesome question compiled by WCC Paul is listed in the FAQ http://paleohacks.com/questions/28585/meta-what-are-some-good-threads-for-people-who-are-new-to-the-site#axzz1HAnWOdzd

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 10:05 PM

The questions yea (if you are on the active tab as opposed to the newest tab) but the answers to those questions are ranked by upvotes - downvotes

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2977 · June 12, 2011 at 9:35 PM

Also, I've noticed that the answers shift a little over time, even my own, and sometimes new info emerges or I learn a new way to articulate my own responses. But perhaps there needs to be a sticky or FAQ section - user generated of course. But that would be a Patrik thing. I also notice that if I ask a Question, I only see the Related Questions AFTER I press Submit - and often those are more relevant than a search.

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18701 · June 12, 2011 at 9:34 PM

I know, Rose, I get it, but I just don't upvote those that won't bother to research. And if someone wants a "new" answer, linking the previous questions and noting that you've searched the tags, but didn't find the answer you were looking for, is really the best way to do that, so others do know you have looked.

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2977 · June 12, 2011 at 9:27 PM

Agree as well Ben. But don't expect a vote ok? Just kidding - up voting now...

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15976 · June 12, 2011 at 9:18 PM

Oh i thought the order that the questions appear in when i come to the site is dictated merely by how active people are in leaving answers to the questions.

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11986 · June 12, 2011 at 9:09 PM

Ya know, I get the frustration with the four millionth variant of a basic question, but I also think a lot of people -- maybe most -- aren't really research-oriented. Maybe folks prefer a real-time conversation to a solitary search in the archives. It's just for those of us who *do* like digging (I'm one), it makes us think they're lazy or dumb. (Geez -- this getting older thing really surprises me; in some ways I'm so much mellower, and in others, I'm much quicker to slice someone up. Funny.)

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 8:56 PM

Yep, the arrows on the side on answers and questions allow to to upvote or downvote things showing your agreement or disagreement. Questions are ordered by how many upvotes - downvotes they get.

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25467 · June 12, 2011 at 8:21 PM

agree Ben.......

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5232 · June 12, 2011 at 8:10 PM

Yep! This is why I love PH. I get such a warm sense of camaraderie from these interactions. :)

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3756 · June 12, 2011 at 8:06 PM

I think it's valid. It has to do with the culture of paleohacks. I upvote like crazy. I don't answer for the votes, but it does bother me a bit when someone comments about how they like my answer, but I still don't get votes.

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12369 · June 12, 2011 at 8:01 PM

I couldn't agree more Kaz ( and it looks ike out voting ratios are similar!

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 7:51 PM

Well if you think about it the reordering effect on answers is pretty powerful, particually when there are a lot of answers.

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 7:40 PM

*nod* I wonder if we should have a "how to use tags to search META and link to that when questions get reasked. I know tags are common, but a lot of people don't seem comfortable with either tagging or using them to search... or bring questions back with a new answer

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18701 · June 12, 2011 at 7:37 PM

Oh, I agree Vrimj, it's just some of them have been asked SO MANY times that you know the poster isn't trying to get new answers, but didn't even bother to look.

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 7:30 PM

I find that if questions have enough of a gap a reprise can be really useful because member's thinking can shift and the membership itself shifts.

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5796 · June 12, 2011 at 7:26 PM

How does this question relate to paleo and/or a lifestyle hack.

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78422 · June 12, 2011 at 7:20 PM

Couldn't have said it better. The beauty of this community is how people thoughtfully provide answers. Upvotes are a way to teach people how to use the forum. Upvoting a question that has been asked defeats the usefulness of the community.

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11986 · June 12, 2011 at 7:01 PM

I think it has a good "metafilter" effect, especially upvotes on answers. It's a metric for finding out what the collective wisdom of the paleo crowd is, if you go for that sort of thing. Of course, many of us seem to be hardcore individualists, and maybe we don't care what the wisdom of the paleo crowd says: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVygqjyS4CA

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1811 · June 12, 2011 at 6:35 PM

Nice try but you're not getting my upvote ;)

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18 Answers

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 1:18 AM

Here's my voting policy.

I try to vote up a lot. I didn't used to do this, but in the last four months I've gone from the 200 range in upvotes to the 800 range. Much of this increase is due to the fact that I've started voting lots and lots of answers up from 0 to 1. My hope is that we can shift the "default" score of an answer on Paleohacks in this way. Whenever someone takes the time to answer a question (and actually gives something that actually is an answer to that question) I think that this should be recognized in some way. So the upvote is like a nice little reward for the effort and kindness given in trying to help out the question-asker and in contributing to the discussion. Now you might think that if we "reset" the default from zero to one, then getting a one will feel just like getting a zero used to feel. But I don't think so. Because whenever you get that one upvote you know that there was a living, breathing human being on the other end of the internet who read what you wrote and appreciated it. And I would say that this response applies even more to new users on the site: they may not know that even if their answer is hanging out at a zero they've still written something that the community values -- it definitely took me a while to understand that silence on the internet can be compatible with approval.

I never downvote and here's why. First, and most important, I just think it makes people feel bad, and you can just as easily accomplish a correction of misinformation or an expression of disapproval by leaving a comment. Why start conflict if you don't have to? (I guess it's obvious that I'm the sort of person who tries to smooth over differences. Although only on the internet as it turns out -- I compensate in real life by picking fights with people on the street, usually two or three times a week. OK, bad joke.) Second, and less important, I think downvoting ends up raising the reputation score of the person you downvote. This might be counterintuitive but I think it makes sense. If you downvote something from 0 to -1 then there will almost always be a sympathy upvote -- so you've just given that person 8 more reputation points (since 10 - 2 = 8). And even if you downvote something from 1 to 0 or from 2 to 1 it is also usually the case that this invokes a countervote in the upwards direction. The reason for this is that we all have kind of a sense for what a "1" answer looks like and what a "2" answer looks like. (So people don't necessarily always upvote something that they like -- because if they think it's good at 2 then there's no need to vote it up to 3; it's kind of like someone has already voted it up for you.) So if you vote something down from 2 to 1, someone else might come along and vote it back up to 2 -- but maybe if that someone else had come by and the answer was at 2 then he or she would have just left it at 2 (since it "felt like" a "2" answer). So if that was the case, then again, you've just indirectly given 8 points to the person you've downvoted. But this is just about reputation scores, so who cares, right? Indeed, who cares; that's why I said that this second reason for not downvoting is much less important than the first reason. But I do think it's worth noting that, thanks to this "ratchet effect," being controversial -- to put it in as general a way as possible -- is an effective way to get a higher reputation score.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 2:20 AM

Not including Travis though! Whoops!

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3631 · June 13, 2011 at 2:48 PM

excellent point re downvote =>rep increase. I prolly won't be using that option anymore. Totally agree w/upvoting 0 score Qs and As, esp when the person has put some thought into it. I hate seeing questions with 0 votes, with several answers - if the question was interesting enough to answer, surely it can be considered "useful and clear".

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2977 · June 13, 2011 at 3:29 PM

I often upvote a Question I've posted an Answer to. Even if it was a "lame" question, I was still interested enough to spend time thinking about an articulating an answer. Answering is itself a kind of vote. I have yet to downvote a Question or Answer and unless it's overtly offensive I never will, mostly for the reasons WCC Paul states, and also that I'm not a 100% skilled judge of character and my being irked at an answer (say, on a politically hot topic) doesn't mean I can't respect and even admire that person in other ways.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 2:19 AM

Thanks guys! Not so sure about that professional logician thing though ... Those math guys are *weird* -- as I'm sure Travis McBride could tell us.

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:30 AM

Awesome answer Paul! I upvote a lot from 0 to 1 for the same reason. I think I am much pickier about questions I upvote than answers.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 5:15 PM

Ah, that's excellent. Just as I find the weirdness of math people kind of awesome I also have a certain respect for the medieval re-enactors. I remember when MDA had that competition to win a cow and everyone was supposed to hold picnics and film them. I really liked the people who dressed up like cavemen and carried big logs around. We're not supposed to be re-enactors in our dieting philosophy, sure, but that picnic looked really fun. Although I admit that if huge clocks started melting that would be a little bit too much.

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3891 · June 13, 2011 at 4:50 PM

@Wcc Paul: I thought I had seen it all in the various shades of nerdiness, being a math guy and all, until I attended a Mardi Gras party one year almost exclusively populated by overly serious medieval re-enactors. It was like a cross between a Chuck Palahniuk story, an Ionesco play, and a Salvador Dali painting. :-))

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24523 · June 13, 2011 at 1:29 AM

Thoughtful is an understatement-- Paul should be a professional logician.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 7:18 AM

Thanks guys! Not so sure about that professional logician thing though ... Those math guys are weird -- as I'm sure Travis McBride could tell us. (Though not including Travis of course!)

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15229 · June 13, 2011 at 1:22 AM

you are a very thoughtful person, WCC.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 7:20 AM

I should probably add that I've just been doing lots more upvoting in general, not just from 0 to 1. But increasing 0-to-1 votes seems like an important project we could all engage in.

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5629 · November 29, 2011 at 6:35 PM

Just ran out of upvotes on you.

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10044 · April 20, 2012 at 12:39 AM

It's rare to see anyone here like you with no down votes in their voting history. That's kind of cool.

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5201 · August 07, 2012 at 8:59 PM

I also think that down-voting is counter-productive.

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15229 · June 13, 2011 at 1:21 AM

i have so far 751 up-votes and 17 down votes. i give someone an upvote is their questions makes me think of something i had not thought of before, if i find myself nodding along while i read it or if i wish i had though to ask it myself. if its well thought out,researched, hyperlinked, and also succinct then ill upvote it. if it makes me laugh out loud (and that was the intention of it), then ill upvote it.

if its a question ive seen ten thousand times (is dairy paleo?) i dont even bother to open the thread, let alone vote for it.

i down vote when i think a question should be closed for being very off topic, shameless self promotion, or just plain nasty. i downvote comments that i think are unnecessarily rude or smug. if someone made no effort to read the FAQ or hang around for a while to see how the joint works before posting, i might downvote.

i do NOT downvote someone just because i disagree with them. i do NOT downvote people if i just dont like them.

ive been involved in a few online forums in my life, and this has been by far the most intelligent, welcoming, and helpful. i value the people here in their diversity of knowledge and experience. in general, i think that everyone here has just the best of intentions, and that this community does an excellent job of policing itself.

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15229 · June 13, 2011 at 1:47 AM

haaa! thanks, lady. i needed those ten extra reputation points so i could sleep well tonight! <3

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2977 · June 13, 2011 at 3:30 PM

Very well said - both of you!

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:32 AM

I found myself nodding along with this "ive been involved in a few online forums in my life, and this has been by far the most intelligent, welcoming, and helpful. i value the people here in their diversity of knowledge and experience. in general, i think that everyone here has just the best of intentions, and that this community does an excellent job of policing itself." so I upvoted. ;)

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10044 · November 10, 2011 at 1:50 AM

+1 to counter downvote :-P

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15229 · November 10, 2011 at 10:10 PM

errrr, thanks rich. out of all the strange reasons to downvote someone, that has to be one of the top three ive seen.

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3180 · November 10, 2011 at 12:07 AM

DOWNVOTE BECAUSE YOU WERE BRAGGING ABOUT LACK OF DOWNVOTES

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5232 · June 12, 2011 at 7:56 PM

I'm very generous with my upvotes. It's my downvotes that I'm stingy with.

I regard Paleohacks not only as a source of valuable information, but also a place where like-minded people congregate and interact. Upvotes, to me, are like social validation. Call me naive, but I like to think that people feel pleased when their answer gets an upvote, and I like to make people happy. :)

Of course, their answer has to be quality, and not just a load of rubbish, but I find that the majority of PHers are very intelligent and typically provide upvote-worthy answers. Conversely, if somebody comes off as a dithering prat or is suggesting something dangerous or stupid, they deserve my downvote. Considering my upvote-to-downvote ratio, I like to imagine I'm overall very content with the answers I find on PH and reward them thusly. :D

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5629 · June 13, 2011 at 12:24 AM

I was gonna answer...but now I don't have to! Great minds think alike!

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5232 · June 13, 2011 at 2:31 AM

Thanks, Futureboy! :)

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12369 · June 13, 2011 at 5:15 PM

Yay for the paleo cheerleaders!

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12369 · June 12, 2011 at 8:01 PM

I couldn't agree more Kaz ( and it looks ike out voting ratios are similar!

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5232 · June 12, 2011 at 8:10 PM

Yep! This is why I love PH. I get such a warm sense of camaraderie from these interactions. :)

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18701 · June 12, 2011 at 7:07 PM

I vote for questions that I think have merit and haven't been asked 8494390213421304 times.

I vote for answers that I think are well thought out or put together or very insightful, even if they don't agree with my views.

I have run out of votes on more than one occasion, but not often.

Just because you have the votes doesn't mean they should all be used every day. I am not stingy, but I do put thought into it.

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3891 · June 13, 2011 at 3:05 PM

Your first sentence sums up my opinion, though I was going to use 10 to the power 100 instead of 8494390213421304. ;-)

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:26 AM

You spent the time compiling it though, Paul! <3

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18701 · June 12, 2011 at 9:34 PM

I know, Rose, I get it, but I just don't upvote those that won't bother to research. And if someone wants a "new" answer, linking the previous questions and noting that you've searched the tags, but didn't find the answer you were looking for, is really the best way to do that, so others do know you have looked.

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 7:40 PM

*nod* I wonder if we should have a "how to use tags to search META and link to that when questions get reasked. I know tags are common, but a lot of people don't seem comfortable with either tagging or using them to search... or bring questions back with a new answer

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 12:40 AM

@CaveRat: It's a link in this text on the FAQ: "If it is your first time here - I would recommend reading this thread to get started." Maybe about 25-30% of the way down the page?

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 7:30 PM

I find that if questions have enough of a gap a reprise can be really useful because member's thinking can shift and the membership itself shifts.

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18701 · June 12, 2011 at 10:39 PM

This awesome question compiled by WCC Paul is listed in the FAQ http://paleohacks.com/questions/28585/meta-what-are-some-good-threads-for-people-who-are-new-to-the-site#axzz1HAnWOdzd

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2977 · June 13, 2011 at 1:59 AM

It's a great list! And probably the reason I didn't see it was very simple: my glasses broke today and I have one side propped over one eye while squinting the other closed! I'll check again after a trip to Walgreen's later tonight.

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11986 · June 12, 2011 at 9:09 PM

Ya know, I get the frustration with the four millionth variant of a basic question, but I also think a lot of people -- maybe most -- aren't really research-oriented. Maybe folks prefer a real-time conversation to a solitary search in the archives. It's just for those of us who *do* like digging (I'm one), it makes us think they're lazy or dumb. (Geez -- this getting older thing really surprises me; in some ways I'm so much mellower, and in others, I'm much quicker to slice someone up. Funny.)

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78422 · June 12, 2011 at 7:20 PM

Couldn't have said it better. The beauty of this community is how people thoughtfully provide answers. Upvotes are a way to teach people how to use the forum. Upvoting a question that has been asked defeats the usefulness of the community.

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18701 · June 12, 2011 at 7:37 PM

Oh, I agree Vrimj, it's just some of them have been asked SO MANY times that you know the poster isn't trying to get new answers, but didn't even bother to look.

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2977 · June 13, 2011 at 12:08 AM

jWell that is interesting Melissa - lots of great info there! But I had to follow the link to see it - I didn't see it on the FAQ page. Or is it right in front of me and I"m just not seeing it?

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2977 · June 12, 2011 at 9:35 PM

Also, I've noticed that the answers shift a little over time, even my own, and sometimes new info emerges or I learn a new way to articulate my own responses. But perhaps there needs to be a sticky or FAQ section - user generated of course. But that would be a Patrik thing. I also notice that if I ask a Question, I only see the Related Questions AFTER I press Submit - and often those are more relevant than a search.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 1:22 AM

Oh and let's not forget that I am only partially responsible for that thread. Most of the links come from people other than myself, including Sherpa Melissa (of course!).

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 7:13 PM

I tend to vote a lot and run out on more than one occasion

To me up-voting is what makes this site more fun and I want people to have the fun of seeing agreement in the form of upvotes as often as I reasonably can offer it, not to do so seems to me to not be using the fun parts of this site and potentially to make it less fun and useful for others.

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19479 · November 10, 2011 at 1:42 AM

I think this question is definitely "Paleo" because it ties into a central theme of evolutionary psychology, reciprocal altruism.

In a society of hairless apes (therefore one that lacks fur and ectoparasites that can be plucked from said fur), we require a way to bond with other individuals in our group so as to give and receive favors beneficial for our survival.

Even though we PaleoHackers interact via the magic of the internet (I think gnomes are involved), we are still monkeys typing away at our keyboards and are in need of the same social stroking.

If someone comments, gives positive feedback, etc. and doesn't upvote, it seems unfair because it is triggering our innate impulse to judge the fairness of a given situation. We have given them something of value and that value wasn't reciprocated. The community suffers if there is a "cheater" who takes value and does not give in return.

This question is itself an attempt at correcting a perceived imbalance in fairness. It will reinforce the desire for reciprocal altruism and will serve as a message to cheaters that it is not acceptable behavior within the community.

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5629 · November 10, 2011 at 5:01 AM

Here ya go FED, +1. Quid pro quo my friend.

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5629 · November 09, 2011 at 10:23 PM

I'm a very generous upvoter. Like I said in the comments, good info, jokes and insight get upvoted by me.

Ed, I agree. I'm always pretty good about voting up people who answer my questions with good info, and love to have discussions in the comment section. Sometimes I lose track of the questions though, and lose the thread of the comments.

EDIT: Apparently people are not so stingy with their downvotes. Gosh, I love humans.

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19479 · November 10, 2011 at 1:34 AM

You just got yourself a sympathy upvote my friend (vis a vis WCC Paul's math, this should lead to a flood of upvotes).

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5629 · November 15, 2011 at 3:42 AM

Apparently someone decided they wanted to anti-sympathy downvote me. :(

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24523 · November 29, 2011 at 5:51 PM

Anti- anti-sympathy upvote.

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9647 · November 29, 2011 at 6:25 PM

Likewise, and you will receive a good tip if I ever come into your bar in NYC.

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11478 · June 14, 2011 at 10:31 PM

A lot of ground has been covered by previous answers, so I'll just add this: in my opinion, a Hacker who poses a question should be generous with upvotes to answers of their own question. If someone bothers to read your question and offer you an answer, they're doing you a favor, and you should vote accordingly. I try to upvote reasonable answers to my questions.

A second point, while I'm on the subject of asking questions: it's good etiquette to offer a comment now and then on your own thread to show that you're actually reading the answers to the question that you asked.

Question management is a sometimes neglected skill here. If you ask a question, you own the thread.

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78422 · June 15, 2011 at 12:07 AM

Bait taken, sir. Well played.

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11478 · June 15, 2011 at 2:39 PM

Sorry Alfredo. My point was directed towards the general PaleoHacks community, not to you specifically. I know that you always pay attention to the threads you start. Cheers

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2954 · June 20, 2012 at 10:52 PM

I wouldn't say they're doing me a favor, a lot of times they're doing me a diservice because I wasted my time in reading their answere. To do me a favor those people should just not answer B-) I agree wirh you that if you start a question, then you manage it.

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3631 · June 13, 2011 at 3:02 PM

I wonder this too! Why be stingy about voting? It doesn't cost anything, jeez.

I use the guidelines that pop up when you hover over the arrows:

  • this question is useful and clear

-or-

  • this answer is helpful
  • this answer is not helpful

Sometimes i replace the word helpful with the word thoughtful, e.g. in the case of personal stories etc. Usually, if someone has taken the time to carefully write their thoughts and experiences, it can be considered a helpful or thoughtful answer, so I upvote.

But sometimes I forget!

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78422 · June 13, 2011 at 12:54 AM

It would be nice if the FAQ covered a bit more about how to use the site. (in the more computer technical sense) It seems like it's mostly about how to treat people on the site and how to ask a question. As well as the consequences for doing it right (badges, votes) or doing it wrong (delete your account)

I definitely didn't know how to use the site at first. I lurked for weeks so voting was not on my mind and when I finally registered I still never thought about it. It was only after finally asking a question and getting votes that I realized it could be important to vote. I now upvote each answer that I think gives the person questioning good information or inspiration. I also upvote comments if they are insightful or truly humorous.

See I still don't know the site cos I don't know what the daily limit is:)

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 12:56 AM

The daily limit is 30. I always assumed that this was just upvotes on answers, but now I think that this is a combination of upvotes on answers and upvotes on comments.

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:31 AM

I always lurk before I start posting somewhere, I think it's important to get the feel for a community before you just jump in.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 5:36 PM

Hmm, confusing. I've been keeping track of my votes today and upvoting comments doesn't seem to add to the vote count. And yet I saw recently that someone couldn't upvote a comment until the next day came. Maybe if you reach 30 on answer upvotes then a side effect is that you aren't allowed to upvote comments? Confusing.

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15229 · June 13, 2011 at 9:15 PM

yeah i ran into that the other day. people were being so damn funny i was handing out upvotes left and right, but it was mostly on comments, then then i got a message upvoting another comment telling me i couldnt upvote anymore for the day. foiled!! im far more liberal with my comment upvoting than my answer upvoting. i use that like the "like" button on facebook- like an interwebs fist bump.

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20908 · June 12, 2011 at 6:45 PM

I reserve my upvotes for something truly insightful or for an answer that is explained better than I could do it.

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37187 · November 09, 2011 at 10:36 PM

I think there's something going on today. I hadn't done anything since early evening yesterday, but when I tried to comment/vote this morning. It kept telling me I was over the limit. First it'll say I can comment in 12 seconds, then it says 3 minutes, etc.

Very frustrating! I feel like I've tried to do less but it's stopping me cold. Here's what my recent report said: 1 Questions 6 Answer responses 8 Answers 3 Comment responses 14 Comments 0 Edits to your posts 110 Reputation earned 0 Badges achieved

That doesn't seem like so many comments and I don't think my edits are showing up because I do that all the time.

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56616 · November 09, 2011 at 10:50 PM

yeah patrik said we were doing a software upgrade today, so prob related

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24271 · November 09, 2011 at 10:47 PM

Or it was, lol.

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37187 · November 09, 2011 at 11:19 PM

Thanks much (hope it lets me post this.)

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24271 · November 09, 2011 at 10:47 PM

Yes there's a glitch. It's happening to many of us.

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18417 · June 13, 2011 at 12:01 AM

Try keeping up with Travis McBride. Good luck.

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5629 · June 13, 2011 at 12:25 AM

I upvoted this. ;)

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 12:44 AM

Oh, that's excellent, I never noticed that about Travis McBride. Don't forget Ed: 2,260 upvotes, in about 15 months probably.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 1:19 AM

In the words of Jim Morrison: "The Midwest ... is the best."

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24523 · June 13, 2011 at 12:54 AM

Travis McBride, sherpamelissa, WCC Paul...those Chicagoans know how to wield a vote.

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18417 · June 13, 2011 at 12:07 AM

he has over 1,000 upvotes in just 5 months. That's over 200 per month. Also, sherpamelissa has over 1400 in just 7 months.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 2:15 AM

Genius, Melissa! We should all have donate buttons on our user pages.

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 1:27 AM

Yeah, but in the true Chicago way, they'll cost you! ;) You can send "donations" to ......

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3891 · June 13, 2011 at 3:12 PM

Come on, Jack you can do it! It's the Chicago way, ya know. Now let me see if I can get my aunt's cats registered to vote for the next election. I'm pretty generous, especially if something interests me or someone is new to the community, though I am starting to draw the line on near verbatim repeats.

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78422 · June 13, 2011 at 4:19 PM

Monitoring this thread, I realized another important way that I use upvotes: to mark/track which answers I've read. This is especially useful in a thread like this, where there is no wrong answer. Even the answers from the newer members who aren't familiar with the issue are useful, particularly with the educational comments below them.

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15976 · June 12, 2011 at 6:46 PM

I've never upvoted. Maybe I should. Does it have an effect?

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15976 · June 13, 2011 at 11:30 AM

Oh i get it now. Bizarre that its taken me this long. That pic i couldnt resist - its from just a few days ago, June 4th, me and three friends did the Spartan Race in Tuxedo Ridge NY. Thats my neice in the pic. Good to get out the city now and again.

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 7:51 PM

Well if you think about it the reordering effect on answers is pretty powerful, particually when there are a lot of answers.

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15976 · June 12, 2011 at 9:18 PM

Oh i thought the order that the questions appear in when i come to the site is dictated merely by how active people are in leaving answers to the questions.

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 1:24 AM

I agree with Rose and Vrimj: it's nice to see what the community has decided is valuable -- even if, of course, you might disagree with the community, and even if you try to read all the answers in a thread, as I always try to do. And nice new picture, Ben: it's like you just drove from the city in your old avatar to the country in your new avatar.

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11986 · June 12, 2011 at 7:01 PM

I think it has a good "metafilter" effect, especially upvotes on answers. It's a metric for finding out what the collective wisdom of the paleo crowd is, if you go for that sort of thing. Of course, many of us seem to be hardcore individualists, and maybe we don't care what the wisdom of the paleo crowd says: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVygqjyS4CA

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 10:05 PM

The questions yea (if you are on the active tab as opposed to the newest tab) but the answers to those questions are ranked by upvotes - downvotes

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18701 · June 13, 2011 at 3:27 AM

Love the new pic, Ben!

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15443 · June 13, 2011 at 4:42 PM

After hanging around here for only a couple of months, I see that about 80% of the questions are basically repeats -- if not the exact same question, then pretty close. The forum would be a lot better (though with less traffic) if people searched before asking, but I guess that is not human nature.

I am probably too stingy with the up votes, but I do try to only give them out for something that is new and different rather than the same old ideas.

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2765 · June 12, 2011 at 8:42 PM

I didn't know I had upvotes???

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9647 · June 13, 2011 at 12:39 AM

Thanks! I should also say: when you choose the "newest" tab on a particular thread then the website learns that that's your preference and sets all the other threads that way.

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6235 · June 12, 2011 at 8:56 PM

Yep, the arrows on the side on answers and questions allow to to upvote or downvote things showing your agreement or disagreement. Questions are ordered by how many upvotes - downvotes they get.

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6235 · June 13, 2011 at 12:29 AM

Awesome info WCC Paul!

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9647 · June 12, 2011 at 11:07 PM

Answers within a question are only ordered by vote if you have it set up that way -- though it is the default setting. I prefer to arrange my answers from newest to oldest; that way I can follow the *development* of the discussion. (And of course I can still see the vote totals.)

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4458 · January 20, 2014 at 3:12 AM

When i post a question, i upvote the answers that address my question (obvious one there i hope).

But, i will also make sure that everyone that takes the time to answer has at least one vote.

So if no one else upvotes them, i will upvote them even if the answer did not really address my question ie. they get a vote because they have made an effort to respond*

*caveat: tho (of course) i will not upvote spam, trolls, etc

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