F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
2

Dietary & Supplemental Protocols for Rosacea, Keratosis Pilaris and Seborrheic Dermatitis

by (10)
Updated about 18 hours ago
Created August 31, 2012 at 9:51 PM

Is anyone aware of any specific recommendations for people who have seborrheic dermatitis, keratosis pilaris and rosacea? ie. foods to avoid, nutrients to consume, etc.?

From what I???ve gathered, biotin, omega-3???s, vitamin A/D/E/K, magnesium, zinc, sulfur, vitamin B12, thiamine and nicotinamide all seem to be helpful for those conditions.

Apparently there has been a link observed between SIBO (small intestine bacterial overgrowth) and rosacea. Now considering seborrheic dermatitis, keratosis pilaris and rosacea are all inflammation related disorders and the great importance of gut health to total wellbeing, it seems likely that addressing the SIBO would result in a cessation of symptoms related to any of the aforementioned conditions.

I???ve seen some recommendations for the GAPS diet, a book called Breaking the Vicious Cycle: Intestinal Health Through Diet, the Specific Carbohydrate Diet, an autoimmune paleo protocol and an anti-fodmaps diet. (At this point I still have yet to look into all of these thoroughly)

At this point I???m kind of overwhelmed with all of this info and maybe a little dissatisfied with the truth that a lot of this comes down to self experimentation as there is a lot of individuality when it comes to these conditions and food sensitivities, etc.

I???m pretty strict paleo as it is and have already cut out most of the major pro-inflammatory ???players??? if not all of them, I suppose a closer look at my diet based on foods mentioned in the recommended texts above combined with some smart supplementation and quite possibly a gut healing protocol may be necessary. I guess what I???m wondering is if there is a single dietary protocol that has already been formed for the 3 skin conditions I have mentioned which I can immediately begin to follow or if I am best off starting with some gut healing protocol.

If anyone has any advice or experience with any of this I would love to hear from you. Thank you.

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · September 01, 2012 at 11:29 PM

You can find a lot of info if you search about "tocontrienols tocopherols antagonists" but here's a link with a researcher about it: http://www.drpasswater.com/nutrition_library/tan_1.html

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb
4393 · September 01, 2012 at 11:04 PM

thx Eugenia, i've never heard of that before, do you have any refs so i can read up on it

A87123772dfaec07079b8fac17b20372
261 · September 01, 2012 at 9:14 AM

I perfectly understand your situation but I have no regrets for my last 18 years. Although I went through some very hopeless days, I've always believed I could have found a solution. The most difficult thing was convincing the people I care that I was suffering. They all minimized and just thought I was a bit stressed. Although I haven't lived so far the life I wanted to, I'm sure I will pursuit all my dreams within the next years and so you should do. You're so young!

A87123772dfaec07079b8fac17b20372
261 · September 01, 2012 at 9:09 AM

I forgot to mention that I eliminated nightshades from my diet plus I take probiotics. I've tried many of them, but after a user on PH suggested me to buy refrigerated probiotics (since all the others on the shelves have mostly dead bacteria) I also noticed some improvements. My probiotic is VSL#3, the only refrigerated I've found in Italy but I'm sure you have plenty and better than this in the US (if you live there). Anyway, don't give up. I have suffered of gut problems and insomnia since I was 15 (I'm now 33). And only now I'm starting to see some light (although I'm not well 100% yet).

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · September 01, 2012 at 8:06 AM

Tocopherols and tocotrienols are antagonists. They cancel each other out. It's very unfortunate that most vitamin E products out there include both.

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb
4393 · September 01, 2012 at 7:18 AM

Hi Eugenia, why no tocopherols?

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · September 01, 2012 at 1:56 AM

I got mine from my local Mediterranean shop (I'm in the Bay Area), but I found the same brand on ebay for $5: http://eugenia.queru.com/2012/08/31/cod-liver-a-forgotten-superfood/

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · September 01, 2012 at 1:52 AM

I'll look into tracking down some actual cod liver, I was looking around for it at the grocery store the other night and couldn't find anything. Perhaps I'd have better luck at a health food store or certain ethnic stores. If anything I suppose I could always order online. I can't thank you enough for all of your help. I'll get started on your recommendations asap.

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · September 01, 2012 at 1:42 AM

Definitely take a look at the answers provided below as they contain some great information which you can implement immediately if you haven't already done so. Ultimately I'm afraid there are no definite or specific answers when it comes to these conditions, just a variety of excellent starting points with all of the protocols mentioned before and plenty of self experimentation to occur. It is only through self experimentation as far as I know that we may find the answers we desire. I will continue to research and experiment on myself and will be sure to share anything useful I come across.

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · September 01, 2012 at 1:39 AM

Rob, you might want to look into fodmaps, an autoimmune paleo approach and possibly the GAPS and/or Specific Carbohydrate Diet and see if there are any foods mentioned in those protocols which are common triggers for most people and eliminate those foods from your diet for a while and see if there is any improvement. You may want to look into an elimination diet where you eliminate many common trigger foods for a period of a month or greater before reintroducing the foods systematically to see which foods you are reacting to. Sometimes it is the foods we eat the most or crave the most.

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · September 01, 2012 at 12:59 AM

..it's not as bad in those areas. Just the scalp which is my problem, I'll take a look at gutsense as well, thank you!

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · September 01, 2012 at 12:58 AM

I too struggle with sleep, I have managed to shorten the length of time it takes me to fall asleep which is great but room for improvement remains. The biggest issue for my sleep that I have as of now is I tend to wake up in the middle of the night, often multiple times which I find disturbing. We eat a similar diet, except I keep my starch consumption low as I'm interested in going sub 10% bf. I need to get started on bone broth/kefir and I'll take another look at the fodmaps. My dermatitis is the worst on my scalp, I get it in the creases beside my nose and the corners of my mouth but..

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 11:34 PM

BTW, for A, except animal offal, I also eat cod liver. Not oil, but actual cod liver. I buy it in cans (imported from Norway), it's really cheap and really yummy.

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 10:57 PM

Personally, I take one fermented butter/cod-liver oil in the morning and a different K2 Mk4 (the specific Mk4 form) at dinner. The vitamins must be in the forms I mentioned them above btw (for example, Q10 Ubiquinol is more potent than Ubiquinone, and E tocotrienols are more potent than tocopherols etc etc).

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 10:55 PM

The S.dermatitis should go away as your gut heals with bone broth etc. It's easier to treat than Rosacea IMHO. For bone broth check this cheaper solution: http://goo.gl/phrWL (lamb/goat/duck offal is fine too). Regarding fermented A/D/K, get the fermented cod liver oil and butter oil from GreenPasture. However, take that for your fish oil supplementation needs, not for A and D. They don't have that much D in them for example, get 5000 IU of D3 oil capsules from Solgar or DrBest. Get tested for D3 once a year or so though, you don't want to be in toxic levels (same thing for A). Good luck!

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · August 31, 2012 at 10:44 PM

...anymore either and I suppose I will stick to apple cider vinegar and baking soda for cleaning with occasional witch hazel. Thanks again, I was unaware of the new research. Do you have any suggestions for the seborrheic dermatitis? As it is the condition out of the 3 I have which bothers me the most, I have a very itchy, flaky, dry scalp which seems to get better at times and get worse but I haven't gotten it to go away completely. From what I read it is a malassezia yeast overgrowth.

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · August 31, 2012 at 10:38 PM

wow, thank you. I have noticed that I tend to do better while consuming 50g of cho or less/day and have been following that. I've been looking into getting a fermented cod liver oil/butter oil blend for A,D,K. I'll keep your other suggestions in mind. I still need to secure a vendor of grass fed/organic meats so I can start eating offal and making bone broth. Considering the mites feed on our sebum and macadamia nut oil is supposedly pretty similar in composition, that would definitely be a no-no, good thing I haven't touched the stuff. I won't use any coconut/almond/shea oil on my scalp...

1133603ea602c6824da56e8b596c9754
604 · August 31, 2012 at 10:37 PM

Wow. That was quite thorough! +1 for that

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 10:34 PM

For keratosis pilaris vitamin A helps a lot btw, but if you're eating offal and spinach you will have enough of it, no reason to supplement.

742ff8ba4ff55e84593ede14ac1c3cab
3521 · August 31, 2012 at 10:06 PM

I have all three skin conditions despite eating well, so I think my problem isn't necessarily the food but how my body reacts to it. I would love to hear if anyone has found something that works for them.

Total Views
5.6K

Recent Activity
3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2

Last Activity
63D AGO

Followers
0

Get Free Paleo Recipes Instantly

5 Answers

best answer

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
3
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 10:09 PM

I don't know if you saw this latest research: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/30/mites-rosacea-bacteria-demodex-folliculorum-bacillus-oleronius_n_1844890.html and http://io9.com/5939277/rosacea-could-be-caused-by-mites-unleashing-feces-inside-your-pores

This says that rosacea is actually an immune reaction because of chronic overgrowth of these mites that live under the skin.

What I would do in that case is this: starve them. The same way we do for SIBO/IBS and bacteria overgrowth: we starve them of sugar. In this case, mites eat excess oil in your skin.

It's possible that what happens is this: Chronic internal inflammation due to bad food -> Immune reaction creates more oily face -> Mites eat a lot and overgrow -> Explode under your face -> Immune reaction to their feces

The problem is that you already have the immune reaction, and the immune system requires at least 1 year of being free of the conditions that make it react in order to "forget" about it. Since all of us have mites (they are part of us), it makes it impossible to get rid of this condition completely, since the mites will always be around, no matter how many you can get rid of. So the only solution really is to ease the condition as much as possible. I don't think you will ever be able to fix it 100%.

A Paleo-ketogenic diet (up to 50 gr of net carbs daily) should manage to dry out the skin a bit (or at least bring it back to balance), while our internals, gut bacteria, and immune system need to be fixed too, so I'd go with hard-core Paleo: offal once or twice a week, fermented foods a few times a week, home-made goat kefir daily (fermented for 30 hours), sea veggies, bone marrow broth, more fish/shellfish etc. I would also supplement with D3 (if not going out much), Mg Malate, K2 Mk4, Q10 Ubiquinol, PQQ, E tocotrienols (with no tocopherols in it), and fish oil (if not adequate O3 in diet). Make sure you drink bone broth daily (as-is, or in stews) so the collagen in it helps with skin quality (otherwise, buy Collagen Type I, II, and III pills). All these pills should help you change the pH of your skin, altering the kind of food these mites eat, and hopefully bringing them back to balance. I'd also get this powerful anti-oxidant formula too, to help with the internal inflammation: http://www.biosynergy.com/products/biosnp-inflammation-antioxidant-supplement-formula/

I would avoid putting coconut or bacon oils on your face (as some suggest), this might actually feed the mites. It might, or it might not, you will have to test it yourself.

Every month, I'd go to a specialist for a deep exfoliation of the skin to get rid most of the mites, until there are not many left (and the diet should keep them in balance from that point on). For daily care I'd use some gentle soap to dry out the skin and then a hydration cream.

I'd expect to see good results within 6 months or so. Although this condition feels more like one of these that might need 2-3 years to ease up considerably. If not, I'd be out of ideas to be honest with you.

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · September 01, 2012 at 11:29 PM

You can find a lot of info if you search about "tocontrienols tocopherols antagonists" but here's a link with a researcher about it: http://www.drpasswater.com/nutrition_library/tan_1.html

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb
4393 · September 01, 2012 at 11:04 PM

thx Eugenia, i've never heard of that before, do you have any refs so i can read up on it

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · September 01, 2012 at 8:06 AM

Tocopherols and tocotrienols are antagonists. They cancel each other out. It's very unfortunate that most vitamin E products out there include both.

543a65b3004bf5a51974fbdd60d666bb
4393 · September 01, 2012 at 7:18 AM

Hi Eugenia, why no tocopherols?

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · September 01, 2012 at 1:56 AM

I got mine from my local Mediterranean shop (I'm in the Bay Area), but I found the same brand on ebay for $5: http://eugenia.queru.com/2012/08/31/cod-liver-a-forgotten-superfood/

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · September 01, 2012 at 1:52 AM

I'll look into tracking down some actual cod liver, I was looking around for it at the grocery store the other night and couldn't find anything. Perhaps I'd have better luck at a health food store or certain ethnic stores. If anything I suppose I could always order online. I can't thank you enough for all of your help. I'll get started on your recommendations asap.

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 11:34 PM

BTW, for A, except animal offal, I also eat cod liver. Not oil, but actual cod liver. I buy it in cans (imported from Norway), it's really cheap and really yummy.

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 10:57 PM

Personally, I take one fermented butter/cod-liver oil in the morning and a different K2 Mk4 (the specific Mk4 form) at dinner. The vitamins must be in the forms I mentioned them above btw (for example, Q10 Ubiquinol is more potent than Ubiquinone, and E tocotrienols are more potent than tocopherols etc etc).

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 10:55 PM

The S.dermatitis should go away as your gut heals with bone broth etc. It's easier to treat than Rosacea IMHO. For bone broth check this cheaper solution: http://goo.gl/phrWL (lamb/goat/duck offal is fine too). Regarding fermented A/D/K, get the fermented cod liver oil and butter oil from GreenPasture. However, take that for your fish oil supplementation needs, not for A and D. They don't have that much D in them for example, get 5000 IU of D3 oil capsules from Solgar or DrBest. Get tested for D3 once a year or so though, you don't want to be in toxic levels (same thing for A). Good luck!

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · August 31, 2012 at 10:44 PM

...anymore either and I suppose I will stick to apple cider vinegar and baking soda for cleaning with occasional witch hazel. Thanks again, I was unaware of the new research. Do you have any suggestions for the seborrheic dermatitis? As it is the condition out of the 3 I have which bothers me the most, I have a very itchy, flaky, dry scalp which seems to get better at times and get worse but I haven't gotten it to go away completely. From what I read it is a malassezia yeast overgrowth.

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · August 31, 2012 at 10:38 PM

wow, thank you. I have noticed that I tend to do better while consuming 50g of cho or less/day and have been following that. I've been looking into getting a fermented cod liver oil/butter oil blend for A,D,K. I'll keep your other suggestions in mind. I still need to secure a vendor of grass fed/organic meats so I can start eating offal and making bone broth. Considering the mites feed on our sebum and macadamia nut oil is supposedly pretty similar in composition, that would definitely be a no-no, good thing I haven't touched the stuff. I won't use any coconut/almond/shea oil on my scalp...

1133603ea602c6824da56e8b596c9754
604 · August 31, 2012 at 10:37 PM

Wow. That was quite thorough! +1 for that

3eca93d2e56dfcd768197dc5a50944f2
11682 · August 31, 2012 at 10:34 PM

For keratosis pilaris vitamin A helps a lot btw, but if you're eating offal and spinach you will have enough of it, no reason to supplement.

A87123772dfaec07079b8fac17b20372
1
261 · August 31, 2012 at 10:41 PM

I have been suffering of Seborrheic Dermatitis pretty much all my life (I'm 33 now). I've tried several remedies with no much success. After I started following the Paleo diet (about 4 months ago), as my intestine improved, my Dermatitis went away in a few weeks. Right now, whenever my gut has problems (and it still does sometimes), my Dermatitis seems to come back a little bit (but never as before). So, I find there's a strong correlation between my gut and the Dermatitis. I had Dermatitis everywhere (scalp=hair loss, eyebrows, ears, chest, etc..).

I've made different experiments and kind of adopting the Paleo/Primal protocol with some GAPS adjustments.

In short, I'm doing this (I'm not a doctor, just a self-trained patient as a consequence of my desperation).

Foods I consume: free-range eggs, whole meat and fish, High-Fodmap-free vegetables (only cooked, never raw) and some fruit (always high-foodmap free, mainly berries). The consumption of veggies per day is very low, less than 30 grams (this is because whatever vegetable I ingest, bloating starts again. This is something interesting I found and suggest you to have a look: www.gutsense.org).

I eat tubers everyday (sweet potatoes, carrots and pumpkin, all cooked with lard and coconut oil), since with low-carb, my insomnia gets worse.

I take omega-3 supplement daily. I drink a cup of bone broth at every meal (3 per day), same with water kefir (I started with milk kefir by I'm intolerant to lactose). In the end I take one tablespoon (each meal) of virgin coconut oil.

I don't eat seeds and nuts (although they are Paleo) cause every time I do, my gut gets irritated.

In the morning I drink a cup of organic green tea leaves, Kombucha plus a bottle of filtered water during the day.

I hope this helps.

Michael.

A87123772dfaec07079b8fac17b20372
261 · September 01, 2012 at 9:14 AM

I perfectly understand your situation but I have no regrets for my last 18 years. Although I went through some very hopeless days, I've always believed I could have found a solution. The most difficult thing was convincing the people I care that I was suffering. They all minimized and just thought I was a bit stressed. Although I haven't lived so far the life I wanted to, I'm sure I will pursuit all my dreams within the next years and so you should do. You're so young!

A87123772dfaec07079b8fac17b20372
261 · September 01, 2012 at 9:09 AM

I forgot to mention that I eliminated nightshades from my diet plus I take probiotics. I've tried many of them, but after a user on PH suggested me to buy refrigerated probiotics (since all the others on the shelves have mostly dead bacteria) I also noticed some improvements. My probiotic is VSL#3, the only refrigerated I've found in Italy but I'm sure you have plenty and better than this in the US (if you live there). Anyway, don't give up. I have suffered of gut problems and insomnia since I was 15 (I'm now 33). And only now I'm starting to see some light (although I'm not well 100% yet).

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · September 01, 2012 at 12:59 AM

..it's not as bad in those areas. Just the scalp which is my problem, I'll take a look at gutsense as well, thank you!

F87174b4bb53fe5083153af70a129063
10 · September 01, 2012 at 12:58 AM

I too struggle with sleep, I have managed to shorten the length of time it takes me to fall asleep which is great but room for improvement remains. The biggest issue for my sleep that I have as of now is I tend to wake up in the middle of the night, often multiple times which I find disturbing. We eat a similar diet, except I keep my starch consumption low as I'm interested in going sub 10% bf. I need to get started on bone broth/kefir and I'll take another look at the fodmaps. My dermatitis is the worst on my scalp, I get it in the creases beside my nose and the corners of my mouth but..

7c09a44d334ef8a8c7c2644b0b7e1383
0
279 · June 14, 2013 at 7:40 PM

Someone mentioned above that Vitamin A is very important. I agree. My nutritionist recommended Green Pastures' fermented cod liver oil/butter blend for my hormonal acne and keratosis pilaris. I definitely think it has helped my skin, though the KP isn't gone by any means :/ My nutritionist, dermatologist and primary care doc say you either grow out of it or you just have it for life.

Cd77fd01d8be999aa91b8678e262f419
0
825 · September 01, 2012 at 5:31 AM

Thanks for asking this question, looks like some great information already and I can't wait to see what might be relevant to me.

I have only a personal anecdote to add. I've had rosacea as long as I can remember, though only recently formally diagnosed. Wasn't hard, since I am a walking checklist of symptoms. I also have an outbreak of perioral dermatitis to go with it.

Since stepping up and being stricter about my fish oil intake, I've noticed my skin looking a lot better in general, no spotty outbreaks (not so much related to the rosacea but fairly common before, despite being pretty strict Paleo), and much less redness overall. I still look like a tomato after exercise, though. I am also using a topical (metrogel) but the fish oil has definitely had a greater effect. The other tip I randomly picked up from the internets is to use pine tar soap which I am also liking, though to less noticeable effect. I just like the smell (:

I've also read several times that FODMAPs are worth avoiding (or at least, worth experimenting with avoiding). I have not gotten around to trying this yet, mostly because it seems overly difficult and my rosacea is looking ok now, but it's on the radar.

I'm taking an antibiotic for the dermatitis, but it's not completely gone and I'm looking for more diet related solutions now, so I'll see what in this thread might be relevant.

6371f0ae0c075ded1b8cd30aafd4bf16
0
4283 · August 31, 2012 at 10:43 PM

news/2012/08/29/13554038-tiny-mites-on-your-face-may-cause-rosacea?lite&_utma=238145375.316280025.1346434850.1346434850.1346434856.2&_utmb=238145375.1.10.1346434856&_utmc=238145375&_utmx=-&_utmz=238145375.1346434850.1.1.utmcsr%3D%28direct%29|utmccn%3D%28direct%29|utmcmd%3D%28none%29&__utmv=238145375.|8%3DEarned+By%3Dmsnbc|health%3D1">http://vitals.nbcnews.com/news/2012/08/29/13554038-tiny-mites-on-your-face-may-cause-rosacea?lite&_utma=238145375.316280025.1346434850.1346434850.1346434856.2&_utmb=238145375.1.10.1346434856&_utmc=238145375&_utmx=-&_utmz=238145375.1346434850.1.1.utmcsr%3D%28direct%29|utmccn%3D%28direct%29|utmcmd%3D%28none%29&_utmv=238145375.|8%3DEarned+By%3Dmsnbc|health%3D1^12%3DLanding+Content%3DMixed%3D1^13%3DLanding+Hostname%3Dwww.msnbc.msn.com%3D1^30%3DVisit+Type+to+Content%3DInternal+to+Mixed%3D1&_utmk=59377006

Kinda Gross.

Answer Question

Login to Your PaleoHacks Account

Get Free Paleo Recipes