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Done with Paleo and fitter than ever

by (144)
Updated about 22 hours ago
Created April 04, 2014 at 9:51 PM

Hey there,

Just thought rather than disappearing I'd fill you in a bit on what I've found works for me.

I was paleo for about a year. At first was eating a high carb version of paleo, then changed to a 2-3 high fat low carb moderate protein meals a day. Felt good at first then started feeling crap. Heart palpitations in morning etc, was extremely irritiable (cortisol spikes I believe due to the lack of carb). Not a happy chappy.

Now following a gluten free version of the Dolce diet (including a lot of carb like quinoa) and eating fruit three times a day (gasp - the fructose!). 3 meals, 2 snacks. Am looking better than ever and have had people say to me recently 'you look so fit!'

I am performing better at gym and recovering more quickly.

I think perhaps paleo is good because it cuts out anything refined but it's not the only answer. And even though we don't NEED carbs I think our bodies function more efficiently with them. And I only think fruit would be a problem if your diet consists of fructose sources in other areas without the water and fibre attached. I still don't eat anything processed but I've effectively broadened my diet.

I could summarise what I'm doing now is high carb, eating more frequently, including carbs and a small amount of fat with every meal or snack. My main protein sources are lean ones like turkey and chicken breast and I don't go nuts on it.

Hope that helps anyone who is finding paleo (particularly the HFLC version) isn't working for them. Anyone who it is working for, then that's great.

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2302 · April 07, 2014 at 3:57 PM

Yeah I feel like most people who don't have a bunch of health problems tend to start strict then find their way here. Fruit and quinoa? Not a problem at all. High carb? Yes, if you are active then carb it up.

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5201 · April 06, 2014 at 8:09 PM

+1...also getting a little bored with ManchesterPaleo's rants.

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1005 · April 05, 2014 at 6:12 PM

It's kind of random you're on here posting so often against common sense.

"Fungal toxins in food pose no deleterious risks to health" -- read the second fucking word in that sentence.. "Toxins". I would argue, yes, toxins are deleterious to your health, obviously. Especially in your damn food supply.

In fact, fungal toxins are among the most carcinogenic substances in existence.

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5 · April 05, 2014 at 5:24 PM

I understand how you think about it, but I don't agree for myself. A toxin is a toxin in the end regardless of whether it can cause clinically demonstrable levels of some symptoms that are formally accepted to be a problem or not, and chasing optimal health is better than trying to avoid diseases.

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15 · April 05, 2014 at 4:09 PM

Fungal toxins in food pose no deleterious risks to health, again, it is pure fear mongering.

And like Dave Asprey, people who preach about this toxin or that toxin and gain momentum with the paleo community, they end up being easily refuted.

Whether it is mycotoxins or it is phytates, it always ends up being shown to be nonsense and unfortunately a lot of people fall for it for awhile.

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5 · April 05, 2014 at 3:16 PM

Ok, I've just realized the nickname may be about a sexy mother consciously after reading your comment here; but you may be right in the way you think because there are so much general evidence on this that choosing this more personel answer to write may sound absurd if you are also looking for very specific research totally including the situation. I admit I do not remember of such specific research to refer to but general research is everywhere. If you really want to know something that is not commonly mentioned even in paleosphere, you can start by searching for fungal toxins in grains.

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15 · April 05, 2014 at 1:08 PM

No evidenc ego back your claims up? WOO PEDDLER!

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15 · April 05, 2014 at 1:07 PM

Because paleo idiots refs to see its not because they removed grains and grains and sugar and HFCS make you fat, mere calorie surplus snake you fat. The whole eat naturally like our ancestors garbage is nonsense and their is no evidence to show humans apart from those with very rare intolerances can not eat processed food swell as fresh fruit and veg and meat and be just as healthy as if they excluded grains and processed food and only ate paleo.

Do you concede that basic point? If not my friend people will keep explaining it to you

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10176 · April 05, 2014 at 10:20 AM

Never heard of Dolce before. Modern Paleo resembles ancient religious food laws IMO, which predate diets. Dolce also appears to preach "Thou shalt not".

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10176 · April 05, 2014 at 10:15 AM

I push for the higher carb side pretty hard here. I believe that ancestral paleo behavior is joined at the hip with ancestral diet. The reason high glycemic carbs taste so good is that they are desirable foods to support constant hunt-and-gather activity. Fats and protein for muscle and endurance, carbs for sprinting and motivation.

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1197 · April 05, 2014 at 2:00 AM

Like what you are saying isn't the basis of EVERY WEIGHT LOSS DIET EVER INVENTED SINCE THE WORLD BEGAN. You are stating the obvious, over and over and over as if it is some key that nobody understands but you. Daft.

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17103 · April 06, 2014 at 1:45 PM

@ManchesterPaleo I don't know what rock you've been hiding under, but every version of the paleo diet out there has these goals:

Removal of harmful toxic foods (gluten/gliadin; industrial seed oils: soy, corn, canola, safflower, "vegetable", hydrogenized anything; refined carbs, artificial colors/preservatives/ingredients; antibiotic and species inappropriate fed CAFO meats, crap-in-a-bag, legumes - especially peanuts due to the aflatoxins they carry)

Removal of calorie counting.

Introduction of an elimination diet to find out if you've got allergies from nightshades, eggs, dairy.

Eating whole, minimally processed foods that are nutrient dense (liver and other organs - not just muscle meats, bone broths/gelatin, eggs - especially the yolks, organic veggies, wild caught fish, etc.)

Eat good quality fats: egg yolks, avocados, coconut and its oil, red palm oil, grassfed butter or ghee unless you've got allergies to them, animal fats including bacon, lard, tallow, etc.

Eat foods in season for the region you live in (i.e. no bananas in winter).

Get good quality sleep.

Indeed, your two statements are equivalent: "In reality it was merely because they ate more fruit and veg, got more protein and ate at a calorie deficit." and "All these Gurus simply say to implement a diet that will lead to a caloric deficit and then they claim its because of the diet they lost fat, got fitter, got healthier."

I haven't seen any "Paleo Guru" - every paleo diet book I've seen has a scientific view of the world, there's no spiritual mumbo jumbo, and they tell you outright that if you eat micronutrient rich foods, you won't have to count calories. You've been pushing this IIFY thing a few days ago, and if anything that's all about calorie counting. Truth is, if you eat real meat and real veggies for 30 days or so, your cravings for crap-in-a-bag (aka calorie dense, nutrient devoid foods) will vanish. The reason this works is that we have in built cravings for nutrient dense foods.

For example, we crave salt, but not plain NaCl, but rather salt that has other minerals too, because typically seasalt comes along with those minerals. We crave fats because it comes along with the other nutrients from the meats, egg yolks, or fish that they're attached to.

We crave sweets because the only sweet foods in nature are tubers, and fruits (and the occasional honey) and these come attached to micronutrients (beta carotene for tubers, vitamin C and potassium for fruits, etc.)

We need to eat seasonally because eating fruit brings fructose with it which signals that it's the end of summer, there are plenty of ripe fruit available, winter will come and food will be scarce, so eat up and build some fat reserves for the lean times. In winter, there is no fruit available, and the ground freezes over, so you can't dig out tubers - the only foods available are wild game.

Of course, not in our modern society where we never see cold and never see real winter, and get berries and bananas, use electric lighting to artificially extend daylight, heat our homes and keep our bodies wrapped up in very efficient clothes, travel in heated cars or trains and don't get much exposure to the cold. Google up some cold thermogenesis to see what the implications of this are.

And all this is simple science with an eye towards indigenous cultures as found by Weston A. Price and others as well as archeological records. I don't know where you get off accusing paleo as unscientific. Perhaps you get your information from The Daily Mail, or Dr. Phil, US "News" and World Report or some other equally questionable source, but your view of what is paleo is incorrect, and beyond ignorant.

I'm not in the habit of writing a book for every troll that comes here accusing paleo due to his own ignorance.

You've been doing nothing but trolling and trying to "debunk" paleo since you got here - giving us BS media fluff pieces about how some dork lost some weight while eating and McD's and jumped up and down and pointed to IIFY, yet your handle says ManchesterPaleo.

Of course anyone can lose weight on a calorie restricted diet and if they have infinite will power sit there and count calories forever. Tell me something, you ever see any animal in nature, or wild human for that matter count calories, or weigh and measure their food? How is it that they're fit and healthy until they encounter western foods - and how is it that when they switch to a western diet they start to succumb to diabetes, cancer, and other modern diseases?

Why do you push calorie counting? What "obvious fallacies" does paleo push? What is it you think you know better?

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5201 · April 06, 2014 at 8:09 PM

+1...also getting a little bored with ManchesterPaleo's rants.

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5 · April 05, 2014 at 10:44 AM

I experimented similarly and I can bet you will feel worse in time and it's shortening your life. Basically I think paleo improved your insulin and leptin resistencies so much that now the extra glycemic load and antinutrients doesn't matter much, temporarily, and also help you attain a more anabolic state. As the resistencies grow back, you'll see that you're on the wrong way.

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15 · April 05, 2014 at 1:08 PM

No evidenc ego back your claims up? WOO PEDDLER!

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529 · April 05, 2014 at 10:07 AM

Do you mean that you're "done" with using evolutionary theory as a tool for assessing better food options, or that you're done with following a particular brand of the paleo diet?

I'm pretty sure you mean the latter, which would bring you in line with the majority of the PH community. Congrats :)

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2302 · April 07, 2014 at 3:57 PM

Yeah I feel like most people who don't have a bunch of health problems tend to start strict then find their way here. Fruit and quinoa? Not a problem at all. High carb? Yes, if you are active then carb it up.

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4991 · April 05, 2014 at 8:07 AM

@Milfy. I have been paleo / primal some years now. Began VLC and after a year felt grim - but had lost weight. BAD digestive issues.

I added in white potatoes, white rice and some buckwheat (which is, despite the name, not a wheat or grain) and began to feel much better. The added some fruit - mainly berries, but the occasional apple, some citrus and a banana pretty much daily.

Lots of organ meat, fish, poultry, some cheese, and eventually began adding regular fermented veggies and kefir, which I make myself.

I'd still consider myself to me primal / paleo, just more EVOLVED, and feel great. I haven't read Dolce, but from the list you've written of what you eat now, I'd consider that another evolution of primal. I'd say your still under the primal / paleo umbrella - possibly an arm or leg sticking out from under it, but still!

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15 · April 05, 2014 at 12:38 AM

Dolce is another pseudo scientist but at least he criticises the obvious fallacies paleo pushes in regards to grains.

Again Dolce says cut out nutrient sparse calorie dense foods, so you will be at a calorie defect by default. All these Gurus simply say to implement a diet that will lead to a caloric deficit and then they claim its because of the diet they lost fat, got fitter, got healthier.

In reality it was merely because they ate more fruit and veg, got more protein and ate at a calorie deficit.

If you want to lose weight eat less than you burn, if you want to get healthier eat more vegetables and meat and fish, if you want to build more muscle eat more protein and carbohydrate.

Simple science and logic trump "dieting"

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10176 · April 05, 2014 at 10:20 AM

Never heard of Dolce before. Modern Paleo resembles ancient religious food laws IMO, which predate diets. Dolce also appears to preach "Thou shalt not".

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1197 · April 05, 2014 at 2:00 AM

Like what you are saying isn't the basis of EVERY WEIGHT LOSS DIET EVER INVENTED SINCE THE WORLD BEGAN. You are stating the obvious, over and over and over as if it is some key that nobody understands but you. Daft.

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