Paleo Diet and Paleolithic Diet Questions & Answers

Question

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http://www.marksdailyapple.com/will-eating-red-meat-kill-you/#axzz1xFhNiq83

So I know this is the article everyone goes to in combating the red meat terror, but when stuff like this comes out http://www.cnn.com/2011/11/23/health/well-done-red-meat-prostate-cancer/index.html

You have to wonder about all of this well-done cooked meat. Here's my problem. What is considered well done? If there's some pink or red in the middle are you safe? Is braising dangerous? A crock pot? MADNESS I SAY! ALL MADNESS!

Thoughts anyone?

OH, and before anyone starts, I'm fully aware this is troll fertilizer for our vegan brethren.

flag	asked Jun 8 at 21:43 Rigton 1,438●1●16

I wasn't trolling...it was a genuine question that seemed unanswered. Not sure why I got downvoted...*sad face* – Rigton Jun 8 at 22:37

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+1 to counter the down vote and because I think charred meat is a legitimate health concern. – Mscott Jun 8 at 23:15

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Mscott, I agree, overcooking meat is a crime against both taste buds and health. Make mine rare. – Karen Jun 8 at 23:18

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In the context of the standard American diet of what we would consider ridiculously high carbs, these studies are true. Never tell anyone to increase their red meat consumption. You would be doing them a disservice. Tell them to StUdY paleo and then think for themselves and take responsibility for their own health and for matching their own diets with their own genes. – bachcole Jun 8 at 23:51

+1 for "troll fertilizer" – Kasra Jun 9 at 0:01

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Crowbar · Accepted Answer · 2012-06-08 23:04:24Z UTC

Steak I eat almost raw. Well done is completely unpalatable.

From my foodsafe course, I remember that the dangerous meats to undercook are pork and chicken. I cook those to the proper internal temperature, as I would for fish. I do love sashimi, though.

For red meats, the bacteria is on the surface, except when it's ground. If you cook the surface of red meat, you're fine.

Most food poisoning is from improper handling though. If you get it regularly, and cook your own food, the meat isn't to blame.

I already don't eat sugar or flour because they will kill me. And I stopped getting drunk and going to biker bars to read aloud my feminist poetry, because apparently that's dangerous. They can pry steak from my cold, dead hands.

Firestorm · Answer 2 · 2012-06-08 23:27:35Z UTC

If cancer is going to take me, it's going to take me with a rare but crusty-black steak in my belly!!!!

Seared on the outside, bloody on the inside and all is right with the world!

Something is going to kill me -- I'd rather die on my feet, with all my teeth, and gnawing on the t-bone! (And since I don't plan on doing radiation or chemo if I do get cancer -- well... I'm more likely to keep both my teeth AND my feet, so yup... that's my take.)

I have to say that I sorta stopped worrying about what was going to kill me when I read articles back in the 70s and 80s (during my years taking biology and writing papers for my ND) that indicated that oxygen, amniotic fluid, and human blood were carcinogenic. shrugs

bachcole · Answer 3 · 2012-06-08 23:57:00Z UTC

I want to say it again so that everyone will see it and can respond to it. These surveys and experiments are done in the context of the standard American diet with their high carbs, processed foods, low and cooked veggies, very little fruit, etc. etc. These surveys and experiments to NOT apply to people serious about paleo. Any questions?

TruthinessInc · Answer 4 · 2012-06-08 21:55:23Z UTC

Well done to me is any meat that chews like boot leather or has the appeal of a flip flop...to me that's to done!

Braising should be fine and encouraged, it doesn't cause any blackened pieces which I have read may be carcinogenic...it just locks in the juices.

I can't do crock pot cusine anymore, everything tastes horrible that comes out of it...it alltastes like wet powder to me, I don't know what it is, something changed on my palate, so I can't really speak to this…but my old crock pot makes an awesome punch bowl shrugs

Truth.

Tyler F · Answer 5 · 2012-06-08 22:23:01Z UTC

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The article starts with "artery-clogging red meat".

Does more really need to be said about this BS?

answered Jun 8 at 22:23

Tyler F
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I know. I was not worried about that so much as what Sisson had to say. – Rigton Jun 8 at 22:35

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That was a guest post by Minger, actually. – Tyler F Jun 8 at 23:06

Did not see that! Sorry, Mrs. Minger! – Rigton Jun 8 at 23:58

thhq · Answer 6 · 2012-06-09 12:18:25Z UTC

They got you to read it didn't they? Hubris is the whole point. Then move on to the next poorly researched feature item. The whole point is to keep you captive.

I find reading the Economist, Atlantic or WSJ more thought provoking. The problem with pesticide-resistant worms in sheep and goats, for instance. Not only does this argue for the short-term adaptability of organisms to life threats, and a reminder of what ancestor diet was like daily, it also is a strong argument for cooking meat to well-done. Nothing all that sensationalist in it. But it provokes thinking rather than lock-step reaction.

And from there we move on to a review of Damian Thompson's "The Fix", wherein it's postulated that EVERYTHING from food to video games is reward-driven (in the dopamine sense) and not to our benefit for survival as a species...suggesting that we need to look back to our hunter-gatherer background for answers...

Jamie · Answer 7 · 2012-06-09 02:40:17Z UTC

It may be possible that overcooked "red meat" (lol, like cow is the only red coloured meat) has some cancer promoting properties. So does black tea BTW, its a proven genotoxic (unlike these studies which are not cause based).

Because this study isnt cause based, the increase in cancer could be for a number of reasons. Perhaps these people eat less anti-oxidants. Several of the studies are on meat and carb combinations like meatloaf and burger patties. Whatever - It could be anything.

Basically with only association, not cause, these studies are scientifically meaningless. But it is possible that overcooking "red meat" can cause toxins of some note. Heck its not like all grok ate was overcooked cow! But until theres a smoking gun, theres no real need for panick.

Future research, on a direct genotoxicity etc studies will be all that will really know for sure. Just cook your beef slower, at a lower temp, or more rare - if your worried. And if your not worried, thats perfectly justified, as these are not cause based studies, they are scientifically similar to supersitition (when I jumped up and down twice, the rain fell, therefor, jumping up and down twice causes the rain to fall)

Red Meat: What’s All the Hubbub, Bub?

7 Answers