Paleo Diet and Paleolithic Diet Questions & Answers

Question

4

My naturopath, using iridology, said I have liver, kidney and thyroid damage and parasites. We paid NZ$50 for the consultation and NZ$400 on supplements which include:

-Calmag- calcium magnesium and low amounts ofvitamin d

-Cleanse for life- vit b6,12,3 and other herbal stuff

-Ionix- vit b1,2,6,12 folic acid niacin zinc and other herbal stuff

-Nourishake- protein shake

-Salmon oil- omega 3

-Pro Vitality- grain concentrate, carotenoid complex and salmon oil which would be vitamin e, antioxidants and omega 3

she also recommended i avoid processed foods(what i already do) refined grains, potatoes(deadly nightshade) and pork(parasites) and dark chocolate. i try not to eat them but sometimes i eat some pork and rarely some potatoes. the diet she has was like an alkaline diet which is basically close to what i already eat (paleo) but they allow whole grain and not pork/potatoes/dark chocolate. i dont eat whole grains though. she said id get better (feel like a normal person) in about 6 months.

she also recommended 2 colonic irrigations $200, and 10 craniosacral therapy sessions at $900(because i had a head injury a few years earlier and she saw a "bubble" in my head that my parents didnt have so its not inherited[i cant really see what she meant by that]) we didnt do those though.

I've also got my vitamin d levels tested and although i was in the sun a lot and tanning because it's middle of winter, i had 33ng/ml. so i took some 50,000 IU once every one and a half weeks because i go in the sun as well. i think im going to be generating some in the spring sunlight now in september.

I'm fermenting my own sauerkraut and starting to have one spoon a day for probiotics. ive only had it for two days. i think it tastes horrible but im still doing it.

I think its working a tiny bit but my parents are unwilling to spend more money on the naturopath believeing them to be scammers(they only went the first time to "prove" me wrong). i finished everything else and im halfway through salmon oil and pro vitality.

Im just wondering whether i still need the supplements or did i only need to take them for one month to get better. ive emailed the naturopath but she hasnt replied yet. ive looked up supplements from mark sissons website http://primalblueprint.com/products/Platinum-Package---AUTOSHIP*.html is in new zealand dollars $240 but im not sure how much shipping and handling is. its really similar to what my naturopath gave me. id like cheaper options if they are available.

Im also not sure if colon irrigations or crainosacral therapies are worth it. i believe i could try and argue with them about everything, but if i dont need the supplements to get better than i wouldnt want to get stressed out about it. what would you guys recommend?

edit:

stuff i probably am going to need to do soon:

liver

diatomaceous earth and pumpkin seeds

test for mono

test for t3 and t4

test for type 1 diabetes

probiotics

test for electrolytes

papaya and pineapple

autoimmune paleo

test for candida

test for sleep apnea

blood specialist and an Endocrinologist

edited Sep 24 at 0:56

asked Sep 22 at 6:25

Samuel
171●1●5

1

Okay, could be chronic fatigue (autoimmune), hypothyroid (is your pulse low, feet cold, is your mood depressed?), diabetes, choline deficiency (you eat eggs or liver), some nutrient lack or probably some others for your energy. Farting and bloating suggests bacteria dysbiosis, SIBO or something else. Have you tried a decent probiotic for that? – Jamie Sep 22 at 7:33

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Have you been tested for Mono? It is really common in high school and university aged people, and will knock you on your ass with debilitating fatigue for months to years. – Happy Now Sep 22 at 7:37

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Natropaths and functional medicine approaches can be great for hard to treat issues (a great example is dan shen from chinese medicine for live issues), but conventional doctors and specialists are still the best angle for diagnosis IMO. – Jamie Sep 22 at 7:37

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Mononeucleosis should be ruled out before trying other things. It is tested for easily from a general practitioner. Have you had a sore throat and swollen glands in your throat any time in the last year? It starts with that, and then progresses into the fatigue/depression stage after that. – Happy Now Sep 22 at 7:58

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I may have overlooked the obvious here, have you had a sleep study done to make sure you are going through all the stages of sleep properly, and your breathing isn't disrupted by sleep apnea or anything? Sleep apnea is most common in overweight people, but isn't limited to them. – Happy Now Sep 22 at 9:43

show 15 more comments

Happy Now · Accepted Answer · 2012-09-24 19:59:36Z UTC

You can get most of that stuff from food. Judging from that list of supplements, I'm guessing she treats mostly vegetarians, or people who don't eat red meat. Keep the vitamin D (I wouldn't worry about taking a ton of it if you are headed into summer though, and a level of 33 at the end of winter isn't bad at all, get it tested again later in the summer) and magnesium, but drop the rest. It is better to eat fish than to take fish oil. If you eat liver and red meat you don't need the B vitamins. Very few people need a cleanse or colonics (they are just like taking antibiotics and decimate your gut microbes), if anything our guts are too sterile these days.

My litmus test for NDs is if they try and sell me on food substitutes like protein powder. If you are eating a paleo diet, you don't need it, you have plenty of protein in your diet already. Your parents might be right about the ND trying to profit from supplements. I don't begrudge anyone trying to make a living, but there is an ethical line on that one that can be crossed pretty easily. I think there is an expectation that patients like taking supplements because they are similar to bottles of drugs we've been conditioned to take for our ails.

If you do have parasites from pork that are causing health problems (I've noticed that to be a pet concern of Naturopaths in Britain, likely originating from vegetarian propaganda, perhaps it has spread to New Zealand as well) you should be taking real drugs to get rid of them. Having a few parasites can actually be helpful in dealing with autoimmune diseases and allergies, but if it has crossed the line that you are developing anemia, organ damage, or there are cysts forming in your brain, it is time to get them outta there. You can get that screened and treated at a normal docs office.

I have a naturopath that I love, but I had to fire a few before finding her. If she started talking colonic irrigation and iridology I'd walk right out the door. Naturopaths can be great, but you have to really shop around to make sure they aren't too woo woo or given to selling fad supplements that they get a kick-back from.

Edit:

I'm hoping these were also ruled out by tests you already had, but here is a checklist of more things to check out with symptoms of fatigue + thirst to rule out just in case.

Hyperparathyroidism
Essential fatty acid deficiency
Diabetes mellitus and isipidus
Adrenal fatigue
Hypercalcemia
Hypokalemia
A bunch of different kinds of kidney disease
Internal bleeding from an ulcer, injury, tumor, or aortic dissection
Chronic fatigue syndrome

Crowbar · Answer 2 · 2012-09-22 15:58:13Z UTC

5

This is rare. I side with your parents.

You don't tell us anything about your sleep habits. Do you sleep enough? Too much? Do you wake with headaches?

As for the craniosacral massage, no, I don't think it's worth it. I have thirteen years experience with neurologists and highly specialised testing, as my daughter had an inutero stroke. I also have the benefit of having lived for the last twenty years in the BC Westcoast Hippie central. IF there IS something wrong with your head, see a neurologist. A bubble? What does that even mean?

And you don't have to worry about parasites from pork if you cook it thoroughly.

answered Sep 22 at 15:58

Crowbar
7,168●2●17

i think my sleep is alright. i sleep from like 9 30-10 30 and wake up around 8. i dont wake with headaches. – Samuel Sep 22 at 22:41

Well, then, there are other things to check out. Your thyroid, your iron levels, are you depressed? Anxious? How is your breathing? You might try a regular doctor, for a full blood work up, and then go from there. Remember, it's your right to ask to see a specialist if you find you're not getting the answers you like. – Crowbar Sep 23 at 3:41

Well, not answers you like, just real answers. – Crowbar Sep 23 at 3:41

my thyroid was normal but im not sure if i tested t3 and t4. my serum ferritin was 140 which is a bit high. im sorta depressed because im tired. sometimes im anxious. it think my breathing is normal and deep. i did go to a regular doctor and we did some blood tests which included a lot like viruses but they couldnt find anything. im not sure what specialist i should go to. – Samuel Sep 23 at 6:54

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I would suggest a blood specialist and an Endocrinologist. GPs are good all around doctors, but not so great at the specifics. Anyways, if the GP hasn't helped, ask him to refer you. – Crowbar Sep 23 at 22:35

VB · Answer 3 · 2012-09-22 07:06:57Z UTC

4

I have never been to a naturopath, but the one you describe is the kind that sounds scary to me.

Red flags:

colon irrigation. I have not heard about the benefits yet, but many people warn against them.
way too many supplements. Are you that sick? I agree with Happy Now - get it from real food. That's what Terry Wahls did.
I actually question some other of your naturopath's ideas, but I am not that familiar with naturopathic practices to where she is coming from. How did you find her? Was she listed in a phone book or did you go by your friend's recommendation?

answered Sep 22 at 7:06

VB
12.2k●1●7●40

	Im really tired and although my diet and lifestyle are pretty much perfect (only things wrong are nothing organic, no supplements and a lot of stress and no excercise[but im sure excercise would make it worse]) i was eating real food and i felt better but i still feel really bad, i was going to go to a one a friend recommended (my friend is a naturopath student) but she was $120 and lived really far away. this one is on the radio and she has 25 years experience. but my friend agreed with the naturopath. – Samuel Sep 22 at 7:19
	I do not really know what to say... First of all, I am tired too but I know the reason behind my fatigue - my digestive issues. Liver can be a part of it. I still think you should take some of her words with caution. Again, not sure what to say. Sorry :) – VB Sep 22 at 7:36
	Oh, I know one thing - STAY AWAY FROM GLUTEN. Not one crumb. Weston Price has an interesting article on chronic fatigue - westonaprice.org/ask-the-doctor/… – VB Sep 22 at 7:38
	yeah i dont eat grain or gluten. not sure i feel a difference though, but its been a year and months since ive eaten gluten so i wont know. – Samuel Sep 22 at 7:43
	Good luck - I have been suffering for four years, but Autoimmune Paleo is helping, although very very slowly. I am thinking of starting GAPS. – VB Sep 22 at 7:59

zoomia · Answer 4 · 2012-09-24 18:38:01Z UTC

4

She sounds like a quack. Sorry.

answered Sep 24 at 18:38

zoomia
1,970●3●12

JeJ · Answer 5 · 2012-09-24 03:00:18Z UTC

Everything about this just screams "please try GAPS" to me!! A simple vitamin D supplement and possibly some magnesium, and just start from the very basics. It sounds like you are spending a TON of money on stuff that sounds so much like a problem with your gut microbiota. Seriously, check out GAPS. Could save you an incredible amount of money and time. My boyfriend's mom dragged him through every naturopathic procedure possible, and while some of them were helpful, most of them were unnecessary and expensive because in the end a simple GAPS protocol did waaaaay more good than any of the treatments prescribed by the naturopath. For some people, that's all they need. I'm not saying it's a for-sure fix, but it sounds like you are the perfect candidate for something like a GAPS protocol.

David Moss · Answer 6 · 2012-09-24 19:25:46Z UTC

Iridology, with all due respect, doesn't seem to be supported by any actual evidence. Craniosacral therapy and colonic irrigations are similarly questionable. It does rather sound like the naturopath is charging you for therapies and supplements that aren't strictly necessary.

Supplements often are useful though, even though in principle a healthy diet ought to sort you out for most things. Eating kidney/liver regularly ought to cover most bases. If you want to be safe, you can just take a multivitamin. Omega 3 supplements are a good call if you don't eat much oily fish, but you can probably get them cheaper. Magnesium supplements are one of the only minerals that it's really difficult to meet the RDA for from diet alone, and maybe iodine (which you could get from seaweed). Vitamin D may also be wise, but again, you can probably get it cheaper. It's best to focus on just eating healthily though, and plugging your normals daily foods into http://nutritiondata.self.com/ to see if there are any major shortfalls.

Nancy · Answer 7 · 2012-09-22 13:30:41Z UTC

I hope you find solutions! My husband and I loved going for a series of colonic irrigations (felt awesome afterwards, and the sheer volume of what left our bodies convinced us it was a good thing) and we immediately used great quality, multi-strain probiotics afterwards to rebuild healthy flora. The above comments, and others I've read are making me rethink colonics though. Still, I'd probably try just one to see how you like it, assuming the colon hydrotherapist is registered, licensed, and highly recommended. For sure I'd pass on the protein shakes, since you're eating paleo. We like Mark Sisson but, yeah, he certainly isn't unbiased when it comes to recommending supplements (which he himself is quick to point out in his book).

Supplements? I went to a naturopath for my tiredness, but my parents dont want to go again?

7 Answers