Paleo Diet and Paleolithic Diet Questions & Answers

Question

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I'm an endurance athlete focusing on 100+ mile and 24 hr races. So I end up biking up to 20 hrs per week. As a result, my carb intake needs to be pretty high - typically 300+ g per day on the average. Believe it or not, this is considered low amongst endurance athletes!!

I've been eating '80% paleo' since 2009 and it has really helped my performance and general health. My deviations are mostly efforts to boost my carb intake and include white rice, oatmeal, lentils, sports drinks/gels/bars, and dairy.

This year, I'm looking to do a more 'strict' paleo approach. For the last month, it worked fairly well - I've been relying on a lot of fruit to provide the carbs. Taking a closer look at my diet, i see that some days I'm getting almost 200+g of sugar due to my fruit intake. So that might be roughly 100g of fructose daily - yikes! I know a lot of this is going to replenish my liver glycogen but I'd still like to minimize the fructose while keeping the carb intake fairly high.

What are the options for high-carb paleo foods that are low(ish) in fructose?

I've tried incorporating as much carrots, squash, potatoes, yams, etc into my diet as I can stomach but its not enough without adding a ton of fruit. Any foods that I'm missing that might be a rich source of glucose and/or starch?

flag	asked Jan 20 2011 at 16:22 perrygeo 41●1●3

Have you checked out the Paleo Diet for Athletes book by Loren Cordain? It's got some great ideas for endurance athletes. – sherpamelissa Jan 20 2011 at 17:13

I do have that book - read it several years ago when I started getting interested in paleo. However, it seems to rely a lot on "food supplements" and the suggestions for increasing carbs are mainly things that I've already tried. You can only eat so many sweet potatoes! – perrygeo Jan 20 2011 at 17:42

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I've been getting lots of comments that completely miss the point. Let's set a few ground rules. Eating carbs and a 'paleo' diet are not incompatible. Carbohydrates are essential for peak athletic performance. If you dispute these fact, please do your research. – perrygeo Feb 5 2011 at 16:02

LiveBigger · Answer 1 · 2011-01-21 18:47:50Z UTC

The FODMAP diet, which is for people with fructose malapsorbtion, recommends the following fruits and veggies- all which are lower in fructose than glucose-

Ripe bananas Blackberries Blueberries Raw cranberries Grapefruit Lemon Lime Orange Raspberries Rhubarb Strawberries Tangelo

Bamboo shoots Beets Broccoli Carrots Cauliflower Eggplant

Also, as strange as it is, white potatos are very low in fructose (in fact, many people w fructose malapsorbtion eat them as a staple).

The rest of the veggies on the list aren't starchy so I didn't include them. Hope this helps!

gone2croatan · Answer 2 · 2011-01-20 19:16:02Z UTC

Beets, turnips, rutabagas, parsnips, and celeriac are all starchy staples in my diet, along with sweet potatoes, carrots, and squash.

Taro and cassava/yuca are quite starchy and available at most ethnic markets. If you try out cassava, keep in mind it has to be prepared properly to avoid cyanide poisoning (fun!). It's very tasty, though, as is taro. Green plantains are also very starchy and delicious.

Please let me know if you'd like suggestions on cooking or pairing any of these foods. A great resource that is not paleo but easily adapted is Chez Panisse Vegetables by Alice Waters.

Stephen-Aegis · Answer 3 · 2011-01-20 19:35:08Z UTC

Perhaps its a matter of making the potatoes more palatable? Kerrygold Butter, Cinnamon, Herbs Spices, alternating cooking methods etc.

I really have to question overcarbing for endurance exercise. Im not going to tell you to avoid doing what you love. But trying to keep running on carbs for that distance is silly, if you allow fat to be your fuel, youll find it much easier to maintain your energy for your marathon cardio.

Eat the starches after in quantities adequate to restore muscle glycogen, consume overall enough calories to make sure you are fueled enough to stay energetic through your next event.

rob · Answer 4 · 2011-01-20 23:41:00Z UTC

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Become fat-adapted, then you won't need carbs. I was out running and out performing people with only 40 grams of carbohydrates daily a couple months back, but I have gotten lazier, and exercise has become a chore, and I lost a lot of weight.

answered Jan 20 2011 at 23:41

rob
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Take a look at the scientific data re: carbs and performance. What you're saying makes sense for everyday activities but has no basis in competitive sports - carbs improve performance, as does the ability to burn fat at moderate intensity levels. The two are not mutually exclusive. – perrygeo Jan 22 2011 at 16:13

Riveted · Answer 5 · 2011-02-04 14:31:16Z UTC

Perrygeo...I agree with your take on carbs from theory, but disagree from an n=1 study of endurance athletes (me). I would never call myself elite or highly competitive, but an endurance athlete I am - road cyclist, to be exact (geez...I feel like I just "outed" myself - please don't judge me harshly my anti-cardio brethren!). I've been paleo for about 4 years, with varying degrees of strictness and put in similar training volumes a few months a year. I ride no less than 50KM and up to 160KM in training (and for fun), and routinely ride 100 to 300KM events through a fairly short Canadian cycling season. I've done 300KM events on a mix of paleo and standard re-feed foods (gels, drinks, Clif bars, bananas...), and I've done them 100% caveman-style. My best results and post-event recovery have been when I'm strict weeks before, during, and after the event. That's no more than 50g of paleo carbs (some fruit) no matter what, lots of fat and meat.

Now...does that mean it's best for you? Don't know. You sound like a more serious athlete than me, so you may very well want to add in more starchy veg, but I would never say that your carb intake "needs" to be high.

Paleo works for this ultra marathoner:

alt text

If you don't know Brian Mackenzie, check him out:

http://www.gotrimax.com/TriMaxBmac.htm

http://www.iamunscared.com/

Cheers, Chris

Travis Culp · Answer 6 · 2011-01-20 18:33:15Z UTC

Were I in your cycling shoes, I'd be eating tons of potatoes all day, but I guess that gets old fast. To hit 300g in a day, you'd have to eat 5 large potatoes. Seems doable.

The fructose you're consuming is not making its way to your muscles, so your performance would likely be far better on a purely starch intake.

One other upside to the potatoes is the not inconsiderable amount of vitamins and minerals: http://nutritiondata.self.com/facts/vegetables-and-vegetable-products/2558/2

You could be far less concerned about hemorrhaging electrolytes, especially since you'd be salting them presumably.

Tom R. · Answer 7 · 2011-01-20 20:00:08Z UTC

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I eat a lot of canned pumpkin post workout for a very easy starchy carb.

answered Jan 20 2011 at 20:00

Tom R.
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mmm pumpkin. I need to go shopping this weekend. – Stephen-Aegis Jan 20 2011 at 20:17

holy hell, this is a great idea. pop it open like popeye spinach. wait a minute, combo time – ben61820 Jan 20 2011 at 23:57

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I am making a pumpkin sausage soup recipe I have this weekend. – sherpamelissa Jan 21 2011 at 0:50

Cinnamon, a little vanilla if you want it on its own. Mixed with scrambled eggs, cold. Slathered on pork chops. Very flexible. – Tom R. Jan 21 2011 at 3:05

Sausage and pumpkin is a great combo! So is a saltier beef. Throw some sauteed onions and leftover roast beef or beef brisket in the mix with canned pumpkin, and you have yourself a meal in a jiffy. primalkitchen.blogspot.com/2010/11/… – familygrokumentarian Jan 21 2011 at 19:14

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Alan · Answer 8 · 2011-02-04 13:27:51Z UTC

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I don't under all this talk of "needing" carbs. We all know that even with super-compensating we can only store an hour or so of carb energy before the body must switch to fat for energy. Why not start out burning fat. Quite a few endurance bike racing teams are doing this now. Even to experimenting with super-compensating fat.

answered Feb 4 2011 at 13:27

Alan
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exactly the point several of us are attempting to convey :) – Stephen-Aegis Feb 4 2011 at 16:21

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I am talking about highly competitive athletics at the elite level. There have been dozens of controlled, double-blind studies which confirm that performance is greatly enhanced with a higher carb intake and not a single one which shows the opposite. Sorry but you can make up theories all you want - if they are not confirmed by science, they are just wrong. Also you seem to think that having adequate carbohydrate stores AND optimizing your fat burning are mutually exclusive which has also show to be false. I've tried training/racing on low carbs and it simply didnt work. – perrygeo Feb 5 2011 at 15:51

Your mind seems firmly made up that you need carbs and that's that. The big mistake you and all these studies you refer to make is their erroneous makeup. You simply cannot do a double blind study in under 6 months at a minimum. As far as I can find there has not been one study where the time to fully fat adapt was allowed. Most were 2-3 weeks, ridiculous! Is a theory that is subsequently proven true false until then? "I am talking about highly competitive athletics at the elite level" Who are you? Have we heard of you? – Alan Feb 6 2011 at 7:17

JRM · Answer 9 · 2011-01-20 21:40:50Z UTC

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you could use tapioca

answered Jan 20 2011 at 21:40

JRM
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Daninidaho · Answer 10 · 2011-02-04 15:45:24Z UTC

All good answers. I somewhat follow a PDFA book advice, first 3 or 4 chapters are good. I do Nordic ski racing (average citizen racer) Post workout: -

Sweet potatoes (got boring until i started making sweet potato french fries!)

-bananas

-Heed (Yes i will use Heed after long or hard workout).

-some left over meat, or egg protein powder if no meat.

-experimenting with Yogurt and soaked white rice.

I don't eat as many carbs during off season and base building, however I do run better on more carbs even when not training or racing. Good luck.

Higher carbs but lower fructose

10 Answers