Paleo Diet and Paleolithic Diet Questions & Answers

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Currently I am not having any supplement, but two substances raised my interest: co-enzime q10 which is produced by the body but its production diminishes with age, to the extent that some people believe that it is one of the substances that drives aging at the cells level http://www.yourhealthbase.com/coenzyme_Q10.htm and also vitamin k2 that also has great qualities, being a key factor in the prevention of osteoporosis and vascular Calcification http://www.suite101.com/content/can-anything-cure-vascular-calcification-a155895 while often not found in sufficient quantities in our food intake, unless you consume unrealistic amounts of eggs or milk.

Do you supplement with any of these substances, or have you thought about them?

edited Feb 25 2011 at 22:39

Elizabeth
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asked Feb 25 2011 at 22:00

Philosopher
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Paul Jaminet's Perfect Health Diet supplementation recommendations are D3, k2 (mk4), selenium, iodine, Vitamin C, magnesium, copper and chromium. – No more. Feb 26 2011 at 6:33

Helen · Answer 1 · 2011-02-25 22:18:44Z UTC

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I supplement with K-2 and since I started doing so, all of the spider veins I had in my ankles and at the sides of my nose have disappeared.

answered Feb 25 2011 at 22:18

Helen
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That's very interesting; what type and dosage? – Travis Culp♦ Feb 25 2011 at 22:29

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I take 2 NOW Foods K-2 capsules per day, one in the morning and one in the evening. – Helen Feb 25 2011 at 22:59

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Well, for a long time, vitamin K cream has been a remedy for spider veins, so I figured that if I had spider veins on my ankles and nose, I must have them where I can't see them, too. So I decided to take K-2 caps. – Helen Feb 26 2011 at 0:29

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FWIW, the NOW Foods K-2 is 100mcg of K2-MK7. MK4 is animal derived and NOW claims to be a vegetarian product, QED it's MK7. BTW, that's a lot of K2 you're taking. The Rotterdam study showed marked improvement at ~45mcg/day, you're about 5 times that level. – PortlandAllan Feb 26 2011 at 5:33

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From what I have read, there is menaquinone (K-2 animal derived) and phylloquinone (K-1 plant derived), so it looks like NOW Foods K-2 is a combination of K-2 and K-1. But whatever, it works and I can afford it, so that makes it ok by me. A "better" product does me very little good if I can't even afford to buy it. Plus, when I take less, the veins come back. So although I take alot according to some study, what I am doing works for me. I live in an area where pastured products are not available. Nor could I afford them even if they were. I do the best I can with the resourses I have. – Helen Feb 26 2011 at 15:00

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Dr. Kate ND · Answer 2 · 2011-02-26 03:06:45Z UTC

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If, like so many of us, you are not lucky enough to have a source for pastured/grass-fed eggs, dairy and meat then you need to learn to love natto to get K2 into you diet. Even if you can get pastured products the K2 content drops to almost nil in the winter time, so other sources (natto or a supplement) are necessary to beat that seasonal trend.

As for CoQ10, as long as you are eating heart and liver regularly (once every couple of weeks at least) you don't need a supplement. Otherwise, you do.

answered Feb 26 2011 at 3:06

Dr. Kate ND
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I don't see how you can make that statement in regards to CoQ10. From the little bit I've seen, at best your statement is true for the elderly. For otherwise healthy young & middle aged people CoQ10 is readily produced by the body. – PortlandAllan Feb 26 2011 at 5:16

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Also, fermented hard cheese is a good source of K2 year-round. – PortlandAllan Feb 26 2011 at 5:17

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There is some evidence to suggest that Coq10 levels begin to decline in early middle age. If you are not physically active, you can probably get by without a supplement. If you are physically active you'll benefit from a supplement, or eat heart regularly. And yes, some varieties of aged cheese (especially Dutch gouda) are a good source of K2 year-round. – Dr. Kate ND Feb 26 2011 at 15:11

Kate thanks a lot for your very informative answer! – Philosopher Feb 27 2011 at 15:18

Travis Culp · Answer 3 · 2011-02-26 00:01:21Z UTC

I eat copious amounts of pastured butter, and thus consume large amounts of mk-7 k-2. I also eat natto on most days and as a result get pretty large amounts of mk-4 k-2. I would wager that one or the other would be sufficient for good health. I'm not convinced that coenzyme Q10 is necessary with our diets.

As far as supplementation in general goes, I do 5000IU for about 1/2 to 2/3rds of the year (high latitude) as well as 3 grams of vitamin C per day. Correct vitamin D levels necessitate correct vitamin k and vitamin A levels. People who supplement D (and presumably those who get a lot of sun) and don't get enough k-2 run into calcium issues. As far as the vitamin C goes, the research I've done indicates that ascorbate increases the excretion of urate, which has various deleterious effects ranging from high blood pressure to kidney disease. It's unlikely that a low-fructose diet would produce sufficiently high uric acid levels to cause problems, but lower uric acid in general is likely desirable.

Harfatum · Answer 4 · 2011-02-26 10:27:53Z UTC

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For people with moderately high blood pressure, CoQ-10 is probably much preferable to pharmaceuticals. It definitely helped me out, as part of my healthy eating and exercise regimen my BP has been reduced about 20 points sys/7 points dia.

answered Feb 26 2011 at 10:27

Harfatum
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interesting information! – Philosopher Feb 28 2011 at 16:26

Jon · Answer 5 · 2011-02-25 22:29:42Z UTC

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Great article on supplementation here: http://thehealthyskeptic.org/9-steps-to-perfect-health-4-supplement-wisely

answered Feb 25 2011 at 22:29

Jon
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Jack Kronk · Answer 6 · 2011-02-25 22:49:46Z UTC

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pastured dairy provides plenty of k2, specifically butter, ghee, raw milk, cream. if you can't do dairy foods, try high vitamin butter oil as a supplement. even people who cannot tolerate casein/lactose can almost definitely tolerate hvbo, as there is virtully zero lactose and very little casein.

answered Feb 25 2011 at 22:49

Jack Kronk
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	I can't get pastured anything around here, except eggs :( – Helen Feb 25 2011 at 23:10
	Look for Kerrygold butter, it is surprisingly commonly available. It s nit advertised specifically as pastured. – AdrianaG Jan 7 2012 at 10:46

Butternut11 · Answer 7 · 2011-02-26 00:01:56Z UTC

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i guess in retrospect supplementation alway seems to be at least disputable. I would try to get those things by natural sources.

answered Feb 26 2011 at 0:01

Butternut11
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Kirsten · Answer 8 · 2013-04-04 19:13:15Z UTC

great info...one thing though, according to my doc, our bodies don't convert vitamin D from the sun any longer, so we all need vitamin D. It is one of the things that we need every day. My husband was recently diagnosed with a vitamin D deficiency, it was sore limbs, neck pain, no energy, tired, etc. Took a vitamin D drop that he got from the natural doc, which amounted to 4000 units a day, but went directly into the body through the mouth, not the stomach. In four days he was feeling alot better. Just hoping this info helps someone. :)

Supplements: coq10, Vitamin K2 are they needed?

8 Answers