Seems like there is a lot of crossover. Did you change? Why? Experiences?
I don't really see the contradiction. Most people are calling it Paleo when they don't eat grains. But Weston Price found huge discrepencies in the diets of traditional cultures around the world. The Massai don't (didn't?) eat grain, for instance.
I think the take home message is, if you're going to eat grains, prepare them how traditional cultures prepared them. If you choose not to eat grains, it doesn't mean that it's somehow not WAPF.
I guess I've never been big on labels.
I started WAPF 5 years ago and just moved to Paleo a month ago. Melissa... the first time I even heard about paleo was from you at the WAPF conference in November! We met at the Real Food Media booth. When I met you (and then John Durant the next day) I "knew" paleo was right for me, but not pleased about the 'no grains' thing. :) Took me a few months to come to terms with that and prepare myself to make the switch.
For me, if I'd heard about Paleo 5 years ago my head would have spun off. WAPF is a much easier transition from SAD. And that transition was NOT easy at all, especially with a family to drag along behind me.
I like WAPF because of their focus on lacto-fermented veggies and fruits, which was just amazing to me. I have incorporated homemade beet kvass, sauerkraut, kimchi and ginger carrots into my daily paleo meals, which has really helped my digestion! Without Nourishing Traditions, I wouldn't be eating fermented veggies with my meat, which I think is part of why Paleo is successful for me now. Thank-you Sally Fallon Morell!
We found WAPF/NT first, but have transitioned to more of an archevore diet. There's a lot of crossover, so we still use many recipes from the NT book; we just stay out of the breads/desserts sections. As others have pointed out, their emphasis on fermented foods and organ meats is great. (Their anti-pork stance is less great.)
I suspect that if you were raised from birth on a WAPF/NT diet, even including soaked grains -- and you lived a traditional lifestyle otherwise, rising and sleeping with the sun, getting plenty of sunshine and fresh air, living without modernity's stresses, etc. -- you'd probably be fine. If I had kids, I'd probably allow them more of a WAPF/NT diet, as long as they seemed very healthy.
But very few people are in that situation; most of us are trying to fix decades of metabolic damage from neolithic foods and stresses (and we don't even know if complete repair is possible), and we don't have the option to leave our cubicles and cell phones and other stressors behind to go devote our days to hunting and gathering and sitting in the sun. So we can't necessarily get away with soaking grains to get rid of some of the harmful contents; we need to avoid all of them.
I discovered WAPF just days or weeks before I discovered primal/paleo. I read "Nutrition and Physical Degeneration" in the evenings while I was perusing the "Definitive Guides" on Mark Sisson's website in the mornings.
I basically view them as both better than SAD. I think grains/dairy can be okay for some people IF they are prepared properly (according to WAPF) and IF they are real ancient grains or real raw and/or fermented/cultured dairy from heritage cows. Jury's still out for me on legumes.
I do better on low-carb, low-protein, high fat paleo. But when I do consume grains and dairy, I try to ensure that they are properly prepared from good sources.
I started in WAPF and moved to Archevore.
I found I did better without grains/legumes even prepared.
Through extensive self experimentation I found I responded well to raw grassfed dairy and PW Tubers.
I respect the heck out of WAPF and consider it an awesome starting point for soft transition off of SAD.
I used Nourishing Traditions to transition my mom off SAD. She's also an "Archevore" Paleo2.0 eater now too, a fact I'm overjoyed with
I started out WAPF and discovered paleo through a WAPF nutrition blog. The author was questioning/giving up grains and did a post about why. I had never, ever read anything like it and I gave up grains that day. She had a link to Kurt Harris' blog and I went from there. Unfortunately I went too far (for me) and ended up eating VLC with bad results.
I feel more like a WAPF eater because they emphasize food quality first, pastured meats etc. and the importance of organs/whole animal and fermented foods. These things are not universally found in paleo dieting. I also like that they are out there as advocates for sustainable farming. Also, I am beginning to feel like it may be more useful to study the traditional societies of more recent times than speculate about paleo man.
I disagree with the questions premise.....the differences are minute on an isometabolic level......on an esoteric level there is a difference. For health and longevity both have the goods.....so is it really a question or just a feeling.......? Both avoid the big three so either will get you to the promised land of a doctor free life
I started out WAPF-like (biggest difference being I didn't really drink milk nor did I ferment my grains), then abandoned grains to become paleo + dairy / primal (still don't drink milk, but do consume dairy products - butter/cream/kefir/some cheese)..
there's definitely a lot of overlap between the two.. especially in terms of meat and fats (at least with the high-fat version of paleo/primal that i do)..
I started WAPF and moved to Primal/archevore/paleo 2.0 relatively quickly. I just don't do well on grains. I think perhaps when I have lost the weight I need to lose I might be able to maintain with legumes, but overall I think grains make my stomach sick no matter how they are prepared.
I started off paleo, and a very strict paleo at that. But the more I learned, the more I started thinking that things like dark chocolate and high quality dairy were not bad foods. So I include white rice and a few things that aren't strictly paleo, but don't seem harmful. This is probably more in line with WAPF, but I wouldn't identify with them because I'm still using paleo reasoning in determining my food choices and I don't agree with some of their positions (gluten grains ok when sprouted, raw milk is magic, etc.)
That being said, my paleo is probably closest in line to an archevore way of eating.
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