Paleo Diet and Paleolithic Diet Questions & Answers

Question

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Okay, so I've read a lot of the research about why soy is bad, and while I'm somewhat convinced, I still don't think anyone has properly addressed the "Asian argument", ie the fact that a lot of traditional Asian diets contain a lot of soy.

For example: http://paleodietlifestyle.com/dangers-soy/

Argument 1: "Asians mostly eat fermented soy which is okay."

Well, no, Asians also eat a lot of tofu, and drink soy milk on a regular basis. In China, soy milk is considered to be a traditional morning beverage.

Argument 2: "When they eat soy, they have it with mineral rich fish broth, which makes it okay"

Really? That sounds like such an ad-hoc argument. Again, that is just not the case. Tofu is used in a variety of dishes, including stir-frys, stews, and even desserts. Also, there's the soy milk again..

I'm not saying that soy is good, but can we not say that the research is still far from conclusive? FWIW I'm Chinese and grew up eating mostly traditional Chinese food.

edited Jul 26 2011 at 20:38

Jessica G
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asked Jul 13 2011 at 19:11

Tony
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ben61820 · Answer 1 · 2011-07-13 19:24:15Z UTC

I lived in Japan for five years. Two years in Yokohama: big city, modern etc. Three years in Fukui: countryside, bit more traditional, etc. Take my experience for what its worth.

Japanese people do NOT eat a lot of soy. They eat tofu regularly yes. But they eat it in incredibly small servings. Something like 2-3 ounces with dinner perhaps 4-5 nights of the week. That’s pretty much it. Soy sauce is used but more often than not it is a fermented, realdeal soy sauce.

None of the soy they eat in Japan is anything like here in the US. There it is eaten as soy: tofu, beans, etc. straight forward in miniscule amounts, in amongst a very un-processed whole foods diet with meat, fat, and vegetables. None of it is a replacement for meat, isolated proteins, oils, etc.

WaveHunter · Answer 2 · 2011-07-13 19:21:47Z UTC

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Evidence of soy milk is rare prior to the 20th century and widespread usage before then is unlikely.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soy_milk

answered Jul 13 2011 at 19:21

WaveHunter
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	Thanks! Didn't know that actually – Tony Jul 13 2011 at 20:45
	While soy milk seems uncommon, the same manuscript from the same site notes that tofu was a staple for many centuries – Dracil Apr 25 2012 at 21:03

Kelly · Answer 3 · 2011-07-13 19:30:50Z UTC

I lived in Taiwan and I never once saw soy milk (ok if it wasn't identifiable to me I probably didn't spend too much time looking at it either). Tons of edamae-yes, lots of soy sauce-yes, stinky tofu yes.

Asians tend to have a whole different set of health issues like stomach and throat cancer. They normally don't have high levels of heart disease and diabetes like we do but this is changing as western foods invade their market (cold stone ice cream, burger king, applebees all there), but they do have their 'own' set of issues based on their diets.

I was surprized at how many really overweight Asians I saw there....then there's the super tiny doll like girls as well.

Happy Now · Answer 4 · 2011-07-13 19:26:02Z UTC

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Damn...I can't remember where I read it, but once upon a time I read that even though modern Asian diets contain a fair amount of soy, traditionally it was used for a cover crop and then tilled into the soil as a green fertilizer. Eventually it became animal feed, and then during a time of hardship people figured out how to make it palatable.

answered Jul 13 2011 at 19:26

Happy Now
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	I remember reading about that too, but Google isn't pulling it up. Some Westerner observing Asian farmers in the early 20th century? He was also remarking on their use of humanure on their fields. – Dunnie Jul 14 2011 at 2:12
	I've wondered about humanure. I certainly wouldn't want to get it commercially, but if it was your own farm, and only your own family, seems like it wouldn't expose you to any pathogens you couldn't deal with. – Happy Now Jul 26 2011 at 21:20

Vrimj · Answer 5 · 2011-07-13 19:14:16Z UTC

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I thought tofu was fermented, rather like cheese is?

answered Jul 13 2011 at 19:14

Vrimj
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Typically it is not, though there are some fermented forms :) – Tony Jul 13 2011 at 19:22

it is not fermented. – ben61820 Jul 13 2011 at 19:23

How do you get the curds w.o bacteria? – Vrimj Jul 13 2011 at 20:16

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stinky tofu has to be fermented, no way to describe that smell.....but one way to clear a restaurant of all foreigners – Kelly Jul 13 2011 at 20:36

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The curds are formed using mineral salts or acid. – Matt Jul 13 2011 at 20:41

Josh · Answer 6 · 2011-07-13 20:02:54Z UTC

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So is stuff like edamame and TVP bad for you? Or is it only bad when consumed often, in high amounts, as a replacement for other proteins. i.e. soy burgers

answered Jul 13 2011 at 20:02

Josh
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	good question, I wondered if edamame is bad for you since its in its pure veggie state?? I'm still allergic to soy but is a good question!! – Kelly Jul 13 2011 at 20:36
	Edamame and TVP are totally different. Things you can eat uncooked like edamame and green beans are generally fine. – Harry Jul 14 2011 at 4:45

Ricepaddie · Answer 7 · 2011-07-26 20:36:27Z UTC

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Edamame is steamed, and not eaten raw which would be extremely unpalatable.

answered Jul 26 2011 at 20:36

Ricepaddie
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Soy and typical Asian diets

7 Answers