I was an adherent to the Doug Graham way for a little over two years. From what I could tell interacting with a large part of the community during that time, 80-10-10 leaves you either emaciated and skinny, or emaciated and fat. There are only a handful of exceptions to this, and all of them are ferociously athletic (marathoners, basically). In fact even the ridiculously athletic people seem to end up looking incredibly thin, despite loading up on as many calories they can possibly consume from fruit and greens.

In my personal experience, 80-10-10 initially seemed fantastic. I started losing weight very quickly and had more energy than I had previously experienced. But after 8 or 9 months, I started losing hair, my energy was low, the weight loss stalled, my teeth were suffering (chewing became physically painful), and I started having issues with depression. At the advice of 30BaD, I dramatically increased my calorie intake (from 1200 to 2300, from 1lb of greens to 3-4lbs). After 6 months of that I had recovered from some of the issues I was experiencing, but gained back a significant amount of the weight I had lost. At the advice of 30BaD, I increased my calorie intake again (by 400) and dramatically increased my level of exercise (from running 20 miles per week to 35, plus weight training). I did that for 10 months and gave up. When I stopped, I was absolutely miserable. One day I would have energy and I would workout and lose weight, the next I could barely drag myself out of bed - and no amount of bananas or date-water could convince my legs to run 5 miles.

I have no doubt the diet can be successful, even long term, for an incredibly active individual who is willing to devote his or her life to their diet and exercise regime. I am definitely not that person. I tried it, I hated it. It's not for me. I definitely prefer a more "paleo" approach to life. Less cardio, less forcefeeding, and a fuckload less time on the toilet. Also more hair. Which is nice.

This diet is very dangerous and some people get really sick from it. I'm included in that and I'm still recovering from this diet 2 years later.

I've written an article about my nightmare of a health on the diet here: http://thepaleodiet.net/how-steve-pavlina-almost-killed-me/

I can only hope that people in search for a solution for their problems will hear about the paleo diet before the raw food diet because it will save them many problem.

what does google think about it? hmm

well that is google's opinion on the matter :-)

I love dogs and was HORRIFIED when Durianrider posted pics of dogs being put in ovens or pig-tied for slaughter, in order to "make his point" about meat-eating. I was so anxious that he would put ideas into the heads of depraved people in this world. He is NOT helping cows & pigs but only debasing the life of DOGS: MAN'S BEST FRIEND. It's another New Age Counterfeit to put man's companion animals on the same level as those he uses for food. VERY DANGEROUS PERSON TO DO THIS.

This was my meal replacement: 10 bananas, 10 dates and blueberries for breakfast blender meal. [Reason for being banned]: Then a piece cheese for lunch and SKIP DINNER. But according to them, NO animal, FASTING OR UNDER-EATING--as that's how you get fat as the body goes into storage mode. But by eating 3 grand calories daily the body "trusts" you & will dis-fatten. That's their theory. Thanks for this forum

This is basically Ornish's diet, with a raw vegan twist on it. I think 10% fat is probably at or below the limit of what's possible while remaining healthy.

It is probably tough to avoid EFA deficiency on this diet.

Cordain's paper on HG macronutrient ratios puts fat at a minimum of 25%. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10702160

Thirty 100 gram bananas would provide (nutritiondata on raw bananas)

• 684g of carbohydrates (336 grams of sugar)
• 33g of protein
• 9g of fat

Minerals (relative to RDA) - 30% Calcium, Iron, Zinc, Selenium, 40% Manganese, 60% Phosphorus, 120% Copper, 210% Magnesium, 300% Potassium

Vitamins (relative to RDA) - 30% A, 60% B1, 120% B2, 90% B5, 90% B3, 150% B9, 450% C, 30% E, 30% K

A not very delicious twist on aiming for diabetes (see Drew's link). The equivalent of yams or potatoes (by calories), which would provide about 1/10th the sugar.

There's a woman I know with a whole passel of kids who is a raw food superstar online. People LURVE her and always cite her as an example of vegan raw perfection. But in real life she is gray with circles under her eyes and all her kids have the same dark circles and bad complexions. Plus they are ALWAYS sick. ALWAYS.

There are some great vegan & raw recipes out there and some of them make sense with Paleo (I just got a book from a friend with some dressing/dips that I think will go well with our new lifestyle) but others are so time-consuming and crazy! I told my husband this is the difference:

Raw/Vegan meal: Soak the nuts then grind to a fine paste. Add sprouted seeds. Chop several vegetables and add a single teaspoon obscure ingredient you paid an arm and a leg for but without which the recipe will fail spectacularly. Eat. Repeat in an hour when you're starving again.

Paleo meal: Sear the meat. Enjoy. Repeat in five hours.

It's interesting that a lot of them are marathoners. I like Robert Lustig's take on fructose and athletes. Paraphrasing here:

"If you're an elite athlete, you can do whatever you want. You can have unlimited fructose. But it's not the athletes drinking the gatorade. It's the fat kids."

So you can probably get away with all that fructose as long as you're exercising nonstop. But I wonder what happens when sedentary....

Regardless, that doesn't prevent you from becoming deficient as hell in various micro-nutrients.

I reckon they are all monkeys.. ;)

To add to what everybody is saying, maybe you'd want to read the experiences of this ex-vegan illuminating:

http://voraciouseats.com/2010/11/19/a-vegan-no-more/

Every day for the past 2 months I have eaten fish or a piece of meat or eggs. To my never ending shock I have found that I digest a meat and veggie meal far, far better than I ever digested a whole grain/nut/veggie meal. I know that the lipid hypothesis is completely fallacious, these animal foods won’t hurt me or cause me ill health in anyway, in fact, the vitamins and minerals they provide, along with the nutritious cholesterol and wholesome saturated fat, will restore my health. And they have. There are few things as healthy and nutritious as grass fed, organic animal products. So, for these past months, I ate animals and animal products every single day. And, I say with a huge, grateful smile on my face: I’m back! After 1 month on my new diet my blood levels were either normal, or almost normal. After 2 months every single deficiency and out of whack number was completely restored to the healthy, normal range. Not one problem. Not one.

They always say you don’t really know what health is until you’ve lost it. And I never realized how unhealthy I actually was until I started feeling better. Glowing is the only way I can possibly begin to describe the way I feel now. If I was a religious woman, miraculous would have to be my word of choice to express the transformation I’ve undergone in the past 2 months. I’m now reveling in my health; basking in the clear headed precision of my thoughts, the strength of my legs when I run, the warmth radiating from my skin, the slow, melodic power of my heart, and the perfect knowledge of my body when it tells me exactly what to eat, how much, and when.eat, how much, and when.

I think when Minger gave up raw veganism, she gave up raw as well. I don't think she eats 100% raw animal products. Someone can correct me if I have misunderstood her.

To their credit, the "salvation" of the LFRV diet is the fact they "overfeed." The 30Bananas a day thing is just a euphemism for the fruitarian diet.

Some of them actually look pretty good, but for most people this isn't a long term diet and never will be.

If they are considered defenders of T. Colin Campbell, then he is in worse trouble than I initially thought. :-)

30 BaD is just another twist on the raw vegan diet. Most raw vegans run into problems with vitamin deficiency particularly vit a, vit d, b12, and k2, all of which must be obtained from animal fats or supplements. Vitamin D can be gotten from the sun but if you live in Northern climate it's nearly impossible to get adequate d. Most vegans report feeling a vibrant glow after switching from the SAD diet. Of course anyone coming off a diet of pizzas, sodas and fries will feel this 'glow' too.

Here's what I think of that site. Even when I was a raw food vegan, I thought those guys were crazy. It's obviously a totally deficient diet. May make you feel okay in the short term, but the lack of very essential nutrients will eventually catch up with you.

Have you ever seen 30-bananas a day....on weed?

My opinion. makkes fruitarian lifestyle sick. NO if you stay playing stay alive. I think it will keep you a live. if you acr like a alive person you will drive on this good fruitarian diet. Maybe there is some exclusions.

I also experiment wiht high fruit periods. and i like eating a lot bannanas and dates. Whatever sometimes they also harm me. It so much relatted among which people iam. in which environment. in which bioregion. do im playful, do im joyful, do i walking a lot. What challanges have my life. Its not just raw food its not just eating? its more thann just eating fruit. If you mmeet rawfoodist some are very healthy other are sick and sad. its on a lot issues. education, social class, ethnic, whatever.

im a bit tired i notice.

the videos bbelwow show you how healthy people can be on fruit. this are just some videos. and decide for your self. follow your heart!

If you wanna eat little or less animal products tthis site can probabbly give you some clever advice(30bannnanandays)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pA4LrpAtu7E

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPZg9q_MUlI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0f4ffQwsso

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCkpEtpZ5bQ

also google for the fruitarian dot org. choose lena the russian american young woman. also you can look michela arrnsteins videos

this little video is different lovely amusing heartspeaking and simple. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdYizCf-yHY

Let introduce mrs. banana joe andd his ffriends...

I have nothing to say about the diet. They can eat however they want. The problem with that site is its forceful oppression of thought and difference of opinion: they coddle themselves in their unscientific vegan world. 30bad.com is good for only one thing: to learn how not to learn.

i felt sick after eating 4 bananas in a sitting the other day (roasted on campfire, actually). 26 more? PUKE INTO FIRE, EXTINGUISHING MY HUMANITY. not paleo.

I used to go on it when I first started Paleo cause it was interesting too see how they justified their diet (or rather, what the enemy was saying). This may just be in my head, but it literally gave me a headache reading all that crap. I started feeling like I did when I was a vegan.

I think Dr. Lustig is absolutely right on the fructose issue.If we eat too much fructose our liver glycogen will fillup and the excess will be put into fat.I tried a vegan diet with mostly fruit yesterday and i gained weight so i'm back with the meat now.They even admit it in the website that you will gain weight initially before your body starts stripping itself down from lack of fat and protein.

This is the first I have ever heard of this and it sounds crazy and dumb to me. And you gotta wonder what the cashier atthe grocery thinks when u r checking out with all those bananas...

Bananas fried in coconut oil taste like candy. I love them. I don't care, however for Harley and his ill-supported schtick. I would think the same of a paleo hob-nobber who spoke so confidently and used sensationalist tactics.

I like bananas, but not that much. Other than that, pshaw, they're not real hardcore in it unless they're eating the skins too. :)

Well, my opinion on it (based on the info you provided) is similar to the one I have on "Skinny bitch" book that I just had a chance to open in a bookstore the other day...

Shouldn't they look like complete and utter shit from all the fructose they are ingesting? It is well known that fructose is the most glycating of all the sugars, 10x more than glucose, yet some of these people look perfectly fine. Although Graham and his wife looked to have aged considerably.

I think that if one banana gives me a spastic colon... I think 30 in one day might kill me.

For people who can digest fruit and do okay with a high-sugar diet (I for one have hypoglycemia with reactive episodes, as well as probable fructose intolerance), it's probably not totally destructive for the short-term. It's also, I suspect, much healthier for women than men. The women on the 30BaD mostly look fine; the men are skinny-fat to downright emaciated.

I have been a vegetarian, a vegan, but never a raw vegan, much less a fruitarian. I ate fairly WAPF-style (lots of soaked grains and nuts, veggies) before going paleo. Plant-based diets are just not healthy for me personally. I know because I've tried, and I paid with my health. Thank god it's been reversible - though I think I'll have to stick to a paleo diet for the rest of my life.