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Hi - I'm wondering if anyone had any thoughts or similar experiences that may help me,

I have some knee issues that i am loath to just put down to irreversible joint degeneration - i am only 33 after all! I have had medial knee pain in both knees get slowly worse over the last 3 years, been eating paleo for the last year. Used to play a lot of soccer on hard wood floors etc and ran some triathlons but never really went crazy with running and i have never been overweight.

So since going paleo and training paleo (without any running sprints as this aggravates the knees) I have seen many improvements in muscle mass, weight and energy stabilization but the knees keep getting worse. I have had x-rays which are normal, MRI however showed a horizontal tear in the posterior horn of the medial meniscus and an associated cyst on the medial menisicus on one knee and some damage the other side in the same area but not severe enough to be called a tear.

Basically I am wondering what might be some of the best paleo inspired strategies for dealing with this or if anyone has had diet inspired success with meniscus injuries- at the very least i want to slow the decline. I am considering a surgical route to remove the torn areas but see this as the last resort as there are no guarantees for this type of tear that it will make the situation a lot better. I know a lot of people have these types of tears and never even know about them and they are common in older people but at 33 I hope I can do something to help them out...

Cheers!

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7 Answers

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Medial knee pain in both knees probably involves articular cartilage damage in addition to a meniscus injury. An MRI with contrast of each knee might be helpful if the MRI you've already had doesn't show anything. Or, you could simply have surgery on the meniscus tear and see what your surgeon discovers.

The board for knees:

http://www.kneeguru.co.uk

The best current treatment for most articular cartilage defects is DeNovo, discussed here:

http://www.kneeguru.co.uk/KNEEtalk/index.php?board=54.0

Kneeguru is also helpful for finding a good surgeon in your area. I'd encourage you to think of knee surgery as a first, not a last, resort when dealing with an injury to meniscus or articular cartilage. These types of injuries tend to be like tears in clothing--they start small, but grow with time.

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Thanks for reply- Problem I see with surgery for this type of tear as a first option is that the outcomes are less favourable - probably because there are some intrinsic problems with the meniscal structure or other knee structures - although nothing came up on MRI. The articular cartilage treatments sound pretty experimental still but I hope they keep developing well as that type of treatment could help so many people. I personally would always feel a little nervous about undergoing a cutting edge surgery that is still in development. – Samisascientist Dec 21 2011 at 6:01
The problem you face is that meniscus and articular cartilage injuries tend to propagate (spread)--and rapidly. While you are waiting for an ideal treatment, your injuries will be getting larger and less treatable. – Daniel Kirsner Dec 21 2011 at 15:55
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I have had similar problems but only in the right knee. I've had it scoped and the ortho doc said the next time he saw me would be for a knee replacement. Then I discovered Prolotherapy and I feel like I have a new knee!!

Prolotherapy is not new. They inject a dextrose solution designed to cause inflammation. The inflammation then increases the blood flow to the new, which stimulates healing.

You can read more about it here http://www.prolotherapy.com/articles/ongley.htm

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Interesting - will have to check out the prolotherapy - seems like it is a better option to try before any surgical work! – Samisascientist Dec 21 2011 at 5:53
Did you have a horizontal/degenerative tear , and how invasive was the prolo ? Thanks! – Samisascientist Dec 21 2011 at 6:03
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I had a tear in the posterior horn too. I'm 41 and been doing capoeira for some years, as well as a weight training regime with squats and deadlifts. Eating near-paleo (I eat my own long-fermented sourdough, and white rice) made no difference. Nothing made any difference. And I was starting to get pain elsewhere from imbalances caused by favouring the injured knee.

The explanation I got from various medical people I consulted was that there is no route to get enough nutrients into that part of the knee joint so it can heal. Except in the case of very small tears, surgery is the only realistic option for meniscus tears. Luckily, it is simple laparascopic surgery. I was up and walking the next day, riding a bicycle within a week, and back to completely normal activity within six weeks. It was very successful surgery as far as I am concerned.

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Knee surgery is one case where modern science comprehensively trumps ancestral remedies. I would find a good experienced sports orthopedic surgeon and get surgery, find someone sports minded not someone who deals with hip replacements all day. Get fixed up, STRICTLY follow a proper rehab regime and get back to bettor than ever.

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Yup - I'm getting a referral for a sports orthopod to see what they think. – Samisascientist Dec 21 2011 at 5:54
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You need to read The Quilt's (Dr Jack Kruse) story of how he repaired himself.

This is a search of his blog for the word "meniscus" http://jackkruse.com/?s=meniscus

He tells his story several times...each a little different...throughout his blog.

Be sure to read the comments section as there are folks that comment about meniscus problems.

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read jleslietx's comment. PROLOTHERAPY IS THE NEW SECRET IN REHAB MEDICINE!!! you'll be a fool not to investigate it. i suffered chronic middle back pain for yrs due to boxing injuries, and after 6 visits my back feels painless. i got my life back

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My name is Lee And I am 34. I have been playing capoeira for the past 4 years until about 6 months ago when I had to have knee surgery. I just started back but I was told they would just sew my "small" meniscal tear. When they went in they found that ALL of my meniscus was removed from both sides of my right knee. It still hurts but the worst part is my knee also had severe cartilage damage that forces my knee cap to go up at a diagonal range. I guess what I am saying is that capoeira along with blessings of God have helped me to recoup. I have been told that I may not even be able to have a meniscus transplant and go straight for a knee replacement. Has anybody here ever played capoeira and had a knee replacement?

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