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He sites studies, as we usually demand, so....is he wrong? Are the studies wrong? Remember, for a long time we all thought Taubes was right, and that conclusion turned out to be flawed. Whose science are we to believe?

Here is the link

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He "cites" studies – Wozza Nov 29 2011 at 19:04
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Quite a bit of what he says is wrong, but not everything. Also, some of the answers below are not entirely accurate either. Science is nuanced; if you're motivated to do so, analyze his article piece by piece, perhaps posting some of most controversial/interesting statements as questions here... – Jay Nov 29 2011 at 19:08
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Taubes may have had some flawed conclusions but many that were right. He not only cited, but deeply analyzed and criticized more studies than any author I have ever read. Some of us are not ready to throw out the baby with the bathwater. McDougal handily picks what supports his conclusion and that's a very flawed, if not unscrupulous, methodology. – edrice Nov 29 2011 at 19:22
Well said Jay!! – Satchmo Nov 29 2011 at 19:22
And yet I see a danger that Taubes is going to become the Ancel Keyes of the paleo movement. – Brad Nov 29 2011 at 21:09
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6 Answers

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His statement that,

"Over the past century there has been an escalating trend in Western societies of people abandoning starchy plant-foods for low-carbohydrate meat and dairy foods. A worldwide epidemic of obesity, heart disease, diabetes, and cancer has followed this dietary change. Thus, there are no exceptions—all large populations of healthy, trim people have lived on starch-based diets."

That's BS. I've lived through most of the century he's alluding to. When I was a child, people ate tons of meat and butter and drank full-fat milk. They were trim.

The epidemic of obesity, etc., etc., followed the "low fat lots of grain" recommendations not the low carb approach.

Even when I tried to follow the low-fat recommendations I couldn't make myself avoid meat. And sooner or later I'd have dry painful skin and would have to increase my fat intake.

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+1 It's evident that when people start makeing up "facts" that bias is hard at work, studies or not. Enough research will tend to back up any conclusion. – edrice Nov 29 2011 at 18:51
"makeing" should be "making" I'm embarrassed. – edrice Nov 29 2011 at 18:52
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That statement jump out at me too. I must be about the same age since I remember the advent of margarine, low fat milk, and no-fat processed everything else. Really dating myself here, I remember when you sat at your own table for three meals a day, no snacking because it spoiled your appetite, and dessert was a special occasion treat. I wonder how much the sheer availability, day or night, of cheap, quick food also plays into the epidemic. – PaleoChimp Nov 29 2011 at 19:27
Need not go any further than that quote to get a good chuckle.... – JayJay Nov 29 2011 at 20:20
When I was a child we ate all that paleo-friendly stuff, but we also ate Wheaties and wonder bread. The 50's wasn't a paleo garden of eating. – thhq Nov 29 2011 at 20:29
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I think he's wrong, for most people. I base my judgement on how I feel when I am on his diet. I never lost weight on it, couldn't stay on it for more than a few weeks at a time without binging on the foods it was missing (I was vegetarian, just couldn't do vegan and/or low fat) and it made me feel sick. In fact, my stomach hurts just thinking about all that horrible food. For most people, it is probably better than SAD, and for "craptarians", but that is such a low bar. But frankly, I have about as much respect for others who compare to SAD and then claim victory.

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Good points! Thanks for sharing your experience with us. – Nance Nov 29 2011 at 18:44
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I never heard "craptarians" before. I will usurp it as my own in the future. – shah78 Nov 29 2011 at 20:01
I feel like his diet is like the other "healthy" diets (like the older WW) that insisted that two cups of milk every day were important. Always made me sick, too. – The Loon Dec 8 2011 at 18:25
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a) people are not obligate starch eaters - if we were those with insulin issues (both Type I and II diabetics) would be dead.

b) he's advocating grains, which we know have anti-nutrients and cause leaky gut and autoimmune issues.

c) As usual, his timelines are measured in tens of thousands of years, not hundreds of thousands to millions of years. Therefore, points to neolithic foods while ignoring millions of years of adaptaion.

d) Advocates carbs over proteins and fats "When cheeseburgers, pork chops, chicken wings, and cheese are the daily fare, then people are fat and sick." which most obese people follow. You'll be hard pressed to find a carnivorous obese person (ignoring the cheese in his statement since dairy, like carbs is insulinogenic.)

Therefore, no different than any of the other Conventional Wisdom advocates.

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"he's advocating grains, which we know have anti-nutrients and cause leaky gut and autoimmune issues." Grains CAN, IN SOME PEOPLE....not all people who eat grains have autoimmune issues or leaky gut. Also these issues aren't caused by grains, they are caused by certain substance within SOME grains. – Satchmo Nov 29 2011 at 19:22
Not all people have an autoimmune response, but almost everyone who eats wheat has leaky gut due to gluten. – raydawg Nov 29 2011 at 20:02
LikesLardinMayo..I would actually go with grains not properly prepared (ie. the way almost all Americans eat them) WILL IN MOST PEOPLE lead to poorer health. I would consider those who have absolutely no poor response to grains in the short or long term to be in the minority. So preparation and type of grain obviously play a role....I just think it is far larger than "some people" that are currently affected. – JayJay Nov 29 2011 at 20:13
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I have yet to have a family member succumb to leaky gut. But a lot of them have succumbed to stroke and heart problems, for which the cumulative cause was inactivity and overeating carb-laden diets. I prefer to dwell on the realities of mortality rather than the shadowy possibilities. – thhq Nov 29 2011 at 21:04
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Most of the meats that obese people eat are convential raised, have fillers with some unnatural substance in them, and have breading or in a bun. The bun often has extra sugar too since wheat isn't very sweet raw. So very high carbs.

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Don't forget the rewarding nitrites and MSG! – thhq Nov 29 2011 at 20:31
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I don't think he's wrong. Adaptation is 10,000 year response, and the amylase argument is a good one. Despite our paleo heritage, we're now very well adapted to metabolize starch, and there's no going backwards on the linear path of evolution.

This does not discount the paleo lifestyle by any means. Eating starch is not a prescription for weight loss or better health. The problem with starch and other high glycemic carbs for most of us is that they digest easily. The resulting blood sugar spikes are fine for energy boosts, but also are effective for pushing bloodstream fatty acids into storage.

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ha ha, obviously you haven't read about his diet or tried to follow it. There is nothing high glycemic about it. A great diet if you love feeling starved, and love constant burping and farting. – The Loon Nov 30 2011 at 15:25
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He sites studies, as we usually demand, so....is he wrong? Are the studies wrong?

he likely cites studies and interpretations that support his ideas while excluding that which did not. to quote my grade 9 science teacher "you can prove anything so long as you choose your facts carefully"

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A follower of the Ancel Keys school of research. – edrice Nov 29 2011 at 19:02
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Often times on some topics, you can quote the same number of studies supporting either side. Heck, studies that support paleo principles are still in the minority, dwarfed by the studies that support "conventional wisdom". – Matt Nov 29 2011 at 19:56
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Thats a good point Matt. Probably why so much just comes down to a philosophical debate. We are all biased. – JayJay Nov 29 2011 at 20:08
But Taubes and others are just as guilty of this as McDougall, yes? – Brad Nov 29 2011 at 21:13
Is this tacit admission that McDougal is guilty? – edrice Nov 29 2011 at 22:00
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