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vegetarian looking to get most of the benefits of paleo

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Updated October 30, 2014 at 5:01 AM
Created December 12, 2013 at 11:21 AM

Hey guys I am interested in going pale, I have been a vegan for awhile, i went vegan to slim down and I have, I have lost 4 stone in as many months, but lost some muscle too. Problem is I can't afford to buy meat. I live in the inner city and my only options are supermarkets which around here are very expensive. I also compete on an amateur level in kickboxing bouts so I need a lot of protein to recover.

due to perks at work I get free protein powder and usually take the vegan warrior brand, but I was wondering if I could eat fresh fuit and vegetables, good fats like olive oil and coconut oil, but instead of going out and buying meat I don't have the money for use a free indentured organic grass fed whey protein.

This would mean me staying out of debt but I am wondering what the benefits will be if I don't eat animal flesh but supplement with whey, omega 3 and b12/k2.

Thanks and I love the site.

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598 · December 16, 2013 at 4:58 PM

:-) yodle...

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41471 · December 16, 2013 at 1:34 PM

"Healthfulness" is a spectrum. You're going to be doing better than a lot of folks, but worse than many other folks too. That's what has been said all along, with the advice how to improve your diet. Take it or leave it and leave.

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15 · December 15, 2013 at 6:45 PM

This is becoming a semantics debate.

You're already going to do the plan you've laid out so why don't you just stop hogging the library computer already. You come in here acting like a dick and expect people to say "oh yes, that's totally healthy bud, go right ahead you'll live longer than an Okinawan!"

Ass.

045e5d7783a95ef731857c5c71fe1427
0 · December 15, 2013 at 6:41 PM

I am asking if eating lots of fresh fruit and veg with whey protein is a healthy way to eat. Not optimal, not the best way, a healthy way. If someone says no I want proof why. that is it.

Now do you have anything to say, or are you just going to keep saying things irrelevant and unhelpful to the question I asked?

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15 · December 15, 2013 at 6:37 PM

Have you considered dropping the kickboxing for something a little more calming like yoga?

I read your question, you just don't like the answers.

"How am I asking for validation? I know this isn't the optimal way to eat."

"is there is any proof that if i eat lots of fresh fruit and veg but substitute whey instead of meat I will not be healthy doing so"

You already know the answer to your question you just want validation for choices you know are poor.

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0 · December 15, 2013 at 6:34 PM

How am I asking for validation? I know this isn't the optimal way to eat. I am not asking for you to tell me that. Read the question or don't comment, is it that hard to read?

045e5d7783a95ef731857c5c71fe1427
0 · December 15, 2013 at 6:31 PM

you are quite an idiot, doesn't read the question, spouts of like an idiot, then just tells someone to leave. You need a few leg kicks to help you build some fucking character you punk.

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15 · December 15, 2013 at 6:29 PM

Then leave.

Hop on over to bodybuilding.com if you simply want validation. You seem to already know exactly what you're going to do, so just go do it.

045e5d7783a95ef731857c5c71fe1427
0 · December 15, 2013 at 6:27 PM

If you bothered to read what the fuck I wrote. I have been given a huge tub of protein powder FOR FREE.

I swear you guys don't even read the question, you just fire off your ready made cue cards.

Very useful, what a help this site is to people.

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15 · December 15, 2013 at 6:17 PM

Wait, you have 5 pounds left before you lose shelter or a gym? And you're worried about buying protein powder? You need to get your priorities straight.

And price per calorie, you're going to be paying way more for fruit and veggies.

045e5d7783a95ef731857c5c71fe1427
0 · December 15, 2013 at 4:53 PM

Some have answered and I have said thank you. Others keep telling me to do things I did not ask for help doing. I asked would it be healthy, suggesting I do something else is not answering. It is being an ass even when I have stated multiple times I will not be able to buy meat.

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690 · December 15, 2013 at 4:41 PM

To whose "answer" does this apply? Additionally; a civil, properly structured conversation would be more likely to produce a usable answer. Insulting people who are providing information for free does not seem like a great way to motivate them to achieve the desired results. :(

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690 · December 15, 2013 at 4:40 PM

This is the protocol on PH.... it's how the system is designed to work. It makes the threads easier to read & more useful for everyone. I thought perhaps you just didn't understand.. but now I see your posting behavior matches the rest. How hard would it be? Do you not see that your "answer / comment" is just hanging out in space & not properly linked to the real answer to which it applies?

045e5d7783a95ef731857c5c71fe1427
0 · December 15, 2013 at 3:54 PM

cheers.

045e5d7783a95ef731857c5c71fe1427
0 · December 15, 2013 at 3:49 PM

Are you for real? How about you don't tell people how they should live according to you?

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690 · December 14, 2013 at 8:40 PM

This repsonse should be a "comment" to Matt 11's comments not a separate "answer"... this really jacks with the Q & A flow. :( Also, if you;re too poor for even limited meat, maybe you;re too poor for your kickboxing pastime?

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41471 · December 13, 2013 at 1:32 PM

It's becoming clear you only wanted validation of what you're doing, sorry I did not deliver.

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41471 · December 13, 2013 at 1:30 PM

Supplemental nutrients as you would propose to replace those missing from meat (retinol, B12, K2, essential fats, etc…) come as a complex mixture complete with natural co-factors. Foregoing meat means you're getting an incomplete diet.

Protein needs are very modest. Nitrogen balance occurs somewhere around 50-70 grams a day. Even if you're active, another 50 grams is probably sufficient. When you consume that level of protein, much of it is getting metabolized into energy as opposed to being used in repair and growth processes.

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0 · December 12, 2013 at 5:30 PM

can you provide evidence for your claims? Maybe my body synthesises protein more efficiently than yours does. We all have different beneficial protein intakes.

and again, I am not asking should I eat meat, I was asking for proof showing ingesting all my protein by way of organic whey , but eating lots of fresh fruit and veg will have any drawbacks to eating fresh fruit and veg with meat. If you can't provide that fine, but saying things with no evidence to someone who is asking for it is counter productive.

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41471 · December 12, 2013 at 2:50 PM

I'll say it again: a little meat goes a long way. A pound of ground beef is maybe $5, that's 4 servings, more than enough for the entire week. A dozen eggs is $2-3. A pound of salmon is a little pricier, $8-10 maybe, or just get canned salmond, $3 for 12 ounces. Liver, $2 a pound, that will last a month. The small amount I would propose you eat is not cost prohibitive, particularly if you're already out buying enough fruits/veggies to meet nutritional needs.

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598 · December 13, 2013 at 5:49 PM

This is Paleo Hacks dude. You're not going to find validation for a flawed approach here. That said, I'm sure you'll get by for many years with loads of veggies and some non-food powdered protein source. You will be less healthy than the guy who's willing to make some other sacrifice to get some cheap meat into his diet. Buy stewing meats, cheap eggs, and liver. They are all very cheap, complete, natural protein sources with side benefits. Where the hell do you live that you can't possibly find meat at an affordable price? It doesn't have to be grass fed, and maybe you have to drive 20-30 minutes to stock up at the edge of town...

045e5d7783a95ef731857c5c71fe1427
0 · December 15, 2013 at 3:54 PM

cheers.

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598 · December 16, 2013 at 4:58 PM

:-) yodle...

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0 · December 15, 2013 at 6:50 PM

@OuroborossoroboruO

So you have no proof that eating this way isn't very healthy? OK, thanks. Now just stop commenting, if you can't provide evidence for your claims why are you posting?

When I went vegan I got the same bullshit from the animal rights weirdoes that I am getting from you but from the opposite spectrum.

Animal flesh is bad for you… No it isn't and you can't provide proof for your claims annoying animal rights vegans.

You saying eating protein in the form of organic whey, which is a very bio available source and using coconut oil, fruit and veg is not a healthy way to live?

Cool, I am merely asking for proof.

I am not asking for proof its not as healthy as eating paleo, I am asking if it is healthy, not optimal. If it isn't please provide proof and I will thank you.

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41471 · December 16, 2013 at 1:34 PM

"Healthfulness" is a spectrum. You're going to be doing better than a lot of folks, but worse than many other folks too. That's what has been said all along, with the advice how to improve your diet. Take it or leave it and leave.

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0 · December 15, 2013 at 3:28 PM

I didn't ask, should I eat meat. I stated I am not going to be eating meat. This is the problem with the dogma around this fucking subculture. I merely wanted to know if there is any proof that if i eat lots of fresh fruit and veg but substitute whey instead of meat I will not be healthy doing so. I am not asking is it optimal. I never asked that. So why is some asshole repeating I would be better off eating meat? I FUCKING KNOW THAT. But I can either keep paying for my fucking shelter, keep paying to train and live life how I want to live, or trade that in to eat shit I can not afford.

So here is the question. Is there any evidence showing that this way of eating is not very healthy? I am not asking if it is optimal, because I already know it isn't. Not everyone is in a position where they can act like 5 bucks a week is no big deal. I am 5 pounds spent stupidly away from not having a place to stay or a gym to train at. So please don't keep telling me something that is not relevant to me. You cultish fuck.

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690 · December 15, 2013 at 4:41 PM

To whose "answer" does this apply? Additionally; a civil, properly structured conversation would be more likely to produce a usable answer. Insulting people who are providing information for free does not seem like a great way to motivate them to achieve the desired results. :(

Medium avatar
15 · December 15, 2013 at 6:17 PM

Wait, you have 5 pounds left before you lose shelter or a gym? And you're worried about buying protein powder? You need to get your priorities straight.

And price per calorie, you're going to be paying way more for fruit and veggies.

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15 · December 12, 2013 at 5:34 PM

Bone broth can apparently cut your protein needs in half and it's very cost effective. After a certain point excess protein is just getting converted to glucose anyway, so you're better off just eating cheap starchy carbs like rice and potato. The only problem there is insulin which can be mitigated by eating fats and acids(sauerkraut, vinegar) with them.

I'd add in .25-.5 lbs of liver a week which is also likely to be cheap. If you want freeze it into small pill sized pieces and take it like a supplement.

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41471 · December 12, 2013 at 5:21 PM

If you can't tell, it's less than ideal. Geez.

180 grams needed daily? Bullshit. You're pissing 1/3 of that away.

Maybe the 3rd time will sink in: a little meat goes a long way. Not asking you to make all of your protein come from meat, or even a major fraction. I'm not suggesting you eat meat for the protein, but rather, everything else that's in it, that's the important stuff. That pack of mince is going to be more nutritious than the pile of fruit you'd be eating otherwise.

045e5d7783a95ef731857c5c71fe1427
0 · December 12, 2013 at 5:30 PM

can you provide evidence for your claims? Maybe my body synthesises protein more efficiently than yours does. We all have different beneficial protein intakes.

and again, I am not asking should I eat meat, I was asking for proof showing ingesting all my protein by way of organic whey , but eating lots of fresh fruit and veg will have any drawbacks to eating fresh fruit and veg with meat. If you can't provide that fine, but saying things with no evidence to someone who is asking for it is counter productive.

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0 · December 12, 2013 at 4:33 PM

its not 5 dollars here dude, its expensive.And I need a lot of protein for training, if i get less than 180 grams a day i do not recover as quickly as I would like. That pack of mince could go to a weeks fruit budget while the whey is free. I am not asking for alternatives, just asking what the difference will be as far as results go.

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690 · December 14, 2013 at 8:40 PM

This repsonse should be a "comment" to Matt 11's comments not a separate "answer"... this really jacks with the Q & A flow. :( Also, if you;re too poor for even limited meat, maybe you;re too poor for your kickboxing pastime?

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208 · December 12, 2013 at 4:06 PM

Not an ideal way to eat IMO, however it is probably superior to what the average person shoves down daily. Keep an eye out for roadkill.

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0 · December 12, 2013 at 2:21 PM

I can't afford to buy meat, thats the problem, I am very poor. I don't even have internet I use the libraries. If I can't eat meat and can only use whey as my protein source because i get it free, how much will that impede me compared to someone using meat v whey. Everything else i consume will be paleo

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41471 · December 12, 2013 at 2:50 PM

I'll say it again: a little meat goes a long way. A pound of ground beef is maybe $5, that's 4 servings, more than enough for the entire week. A dozen eggs is $2-3. A pound of salmon is a little pricier, $8-10 maybe, or just get canned salmond, $3 for 12 ounces. Liver, $2 a pound, that will last a month. The small amount I would propose you eat is not cost prohibitive, particularly if you're already out buying enough fruits/veggies to meet nutritional needs.

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41471 · December 12, 2013 at 1:50 PM

A little meat goes a long way. Gone are the days of the meat-crazed paleo diet. A vegetarian diet with eggs, loads of veggies and fruit, with healthy fats would be great. Toss in a couple servings of meat (beef, salmon, offal, & bivalves have the most nutritional punch) a week and you're set.

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